{"conf": "deeper", "generated_at": "2026-04-26T08:00:02.954878Z", "threads": [{"num": 1, "subject": "allow me to introduce myself", "response_count": 2, "posts": [{"response": 1, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan 19, 1997 (19:30)", "body": "I just set up on ICQ and I see that Amy is set up there. I sent the info to kaf as well. My UID is 203760. I have a dedicated connection at home now so you should be able to connect to me more reliably. The url of my home machine is http://207.113.199.75 Try these out and let me know if you can get in touch with me this way. To get on ICQ: http://www.mirabilis.com/pub/icqsetup.exe"}, {"response": 2, "author": "sprin5", "date": "Tue, Apr 25, 2000 (08:27)", "body": "Outdated! I just revived deeper. deeper conference Main Menu"}]}, {"num": 10, "subject": "Hosting other conferences", "response_count": 6, "posts": [{"response": 1, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (11:49)", "body": "Current hosts: apps Forest Stroud and me media Jeff Daniel austen Amy food KitchenManager cultures William Meyers (on sabbatical)"}, {"response": 2, "author": "terry", "date": "Sat, Jan  4, 1997 (07:55)", "body": "Any other ideas for hosts? We just started a parenting conference."}, {"response": 3, "author": "terry", "date": "Sat, Jan  4, 1997 (09:37)", "body": "Current conferences with the number of topics: apps 327 austen 121 yapp 41 sports 30 web 28 deeper 21 media 19 music 16 internet 15 radio 14 books 12 austin 12 food 10 projects 10 cultures 9 porch 8 windows 7 dpo 6 dsm 5 tv 5 movies 5 environment 5 community 5 poetry 5 travel 5 fitness 4 politics 4 politics 4 sex 4 newtest 3 computer 2 techbusiness 2 restaurants 1 austentest 1 lovelinks 0 art 0 parent 0"}, {"response": 4, "author": "mrobens", "date": "Sun, Jan  5, 1997 (10:17)", "body": "Terry, I may just be speaking for myself (or possibly reflecting the members of the Austen conference), but it seems to me that people are looking for something quite specific when they are searching for web sites. When I found the Auten Conference (actually, it's predecessor), I wasn't looking for 'books' or 'literature', I was looking for something related to Jane Austen and specifically Pride and Prejudice. Maybe you need to concentrate on publicizing the availability of the Spring and its capabilities. If you build it, they will come."}, {"response": 5, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan  5, 1997 (11:25)", "body": "I'm coming around to this philosophy. Let's dig deeper into the specifics of this and how we could get this to happen."}, {"response": 6, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan 13, 1997 (05:23)", "body": "How about a golf confrence? deeper conference Main Menu"}]}, {"num": 11, "subject": "Yapp Issues", "response_count": 67, "posts": [{"response": 1, "author": "terry", "date": "Tue, Dec 31, 1996 (11:12)", "body": "Number one issue: what is the next versio going to look like? Number two: getting admin folks trained to using the admin interface? Does anyone have the manual yet in readable form?"}, {"response": 2, "author": "Amy", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (06:22)", "body": "Terry, Joan, Myretta, Kaff and I talked about a lot of nitty gritty issues like file permissions last night for over two hours. Myretta will be summarizing for you soon. I think we are finally on the road. Any recent word on what features the new version will include? I had another report of the dreaded \"everything old is new again\" syndrome as Myretta has termed it. I hope this at least can be fixed in the new version, as it is not just an enhancement but a pretty major bug."}, {"response": 3, "author": "Amy", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (07:35)", "body": "Terry, could we link this topic to the Yapp conference so Dave can see the discussion? I don't think I can do it, since I don't have Yapp host permissions there, only here in the deeper, conference."}, {"response": 4, "author": "Amy", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (07:38)", "body": "Myretta, I am beginning to better understand what you were saying about Yapp permissions overruling UNIX permissions. This morning, even as su I was not able to join this conference (the deeper conference), I presume because su is not on the ulist!"}, {"response": 5, "author": "mrobens", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (13:28)", "body": "]This morning, even as su I was not able to join this conference (the deeper conference), I presume because su is not on the ulist! Yes, exactly so. I've left Terry a message about my proposal to act as Austin administrator on the Projects conference. I don't know exactly where I shoujld be leaving these messages. I'll start the Austen Admin topic this after noon and I guess this would be a good place to summarize our discussion."}, {"response": 6, "author": "mrobens", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (13:47)", "body": "Amy, Kaff, Joan and I discussed the following issues last night. I summarize the discussion. I have not had a chance today to look for solutions, but perhaps, you already know them. 1. When a topic is created from the web interface, the file ownership is cfadm and the permissions are rw-r--r--. This would indicate, of course, that only cfadm can write to the file. However, any conference member can write to this file. I conclude that the yapp web interface is recognized as cfadm. 2. We have had complaints that users who have written to topics using the web interface and then try to scribble or edit them though the yapp shell, cannot. My guess is that this is caused because they are recognized as themselves by the shell and, therefore, do not have write permissions on the topic files. Is this so? Is there a solution? 3. Users who have resorted to the UNIX editor to modify files, end of as owner of the file. This tends to prevent anyone else from writing to the topic. 4. Several of us have root access now and would like to be careful not to abuse it. I have proposed that I act as the administrator of the Austen conference, but do not think it a problem if the other members of this group, use their access to modify the austentest conference and ensure that file permissions are manually changed to allow conference member access. 5. Is yapp set up so that registered conference members constitute the user group for a given conference or is the group defined by all bbs users? I think this is it, for now. Please feel free to contact me in any way that seems efficient. I will, of course, continue to frequent this conference. Thanks for everything."}, {"response": 7, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Sat, Jan  4, 1997 (04:38)", "body": "I hope this is the appropriate place for thisL Folks I would like to suggest that someone who can review this \"help\" text and do a little editing on it if that is possible. To start with, it looks as if whoever wrote it was speaking \"Caucus\", for if I am understanding it correctly, the word \"item\" is used each time \"topic\" is meant - which makes it very unclear exactly what is being killed, frozen, entered, scribbled, or whatever. Some of the descriptions could also be clearer - for example, does \"enter a new item\" mean \"go into\" or \"create\"? Also, the \"_'s denote minimal abbreviations\" coding does not appear to be completely accurate. I was asked (by its author) to remove a duplicate topic that had accidentally been begun, so I tried using just the \"k\" of \"kill\" - which did not work, although the full word did. (I inserted a few other questions into the list beneath the existing explanations.) Commands available only at this prompt (_'s denote minimal abbreviations): - display all responses in the specified range cen_sor - censor a response does this mean edit? or what? e_nter - enter a new item f_ind \"text\" - show all responses including a string of text forget - pretend item doen't exist freeze - stop any further responses to this item prevent any further responses to this topic h_eader - redisplay item header k_ill - delete this item from current conference n_ew - stop reading, and leave responses here as new p_ass - go on to next item po_stpone - go on to next item, leaving responses here as new ps_eudonym - respond to item using a pseudonym r_espond - add a response to this item rem_ember - remove the forgotten status of this item reply - send mail to the author of a response retire - make this item inaccessible to people scr_ibble - censor and scribble over a response this is very unclear - and in practice it ends up leaving the header there! st_op - stop reading thaw - let people respond to this item again tree - show diagram of response tree how can this tree be formed? unretire - make this item accessible to people again"}, {"response": 8, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Sat, Jan  4, 1997 (04:41)", "body": "Sorry the above wrapped wierdly! One more thing; Other help topics that might be useful are: intro_duction - describe the layout of the conferencing system commands - list the commands available at this prompt Ok: commands Invalid command: commands (It appears to tell the user that a list of commands can be obtained by typing in \"command\" but this does not work.)"}, {"response": 9, "author": "terry", "date": "Sat, Jan  4, 1997 (08:07)", "body": "You're right topic and item are one and the same. We have the option of calling these things whatever we want. Enter a new item (or topic) means to create it. I use 'e' a lot! Caucus was superior in handling minimal abbreviations. You can enter *several* variants of a word and it works. For example, all these might work: c ch che chec check etc. Response range refers to a group of responses, eg. 3-4 As for cen_sor I haven't tried it. Create a response that is expandable and try it and see what happends. I use the 'n' command continually. This is something I'd like to start using: reply - send mail to the author of a response I wonder if this refers to unix mail or some kind of internal mail system like caucus, I'd be surprised if it was internal. This is designed to spare readers the trouble of reading a long response. They can have the option of seeing it if they want. scr_ibble - censor and scribble over a response I would like to know the answer to this, ask Dave in the yapp conference. tree - show diagram of response tree Ok: commands Invalid command: commands You have to type help commands I believe."}, {"response": 10, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Sat, Jan  4, 1997 (16:52)", "body": "Last night I was looking at this topic in bbs/text format - today I am looking in web format - and I see a rather nasty \"problem\" here - the appearance between one format and another changes radicaly and can make reading in the one not used to create the text very difficult. Response #7 is wraped wierdly in bbs format, but completely unformatted in web viewing. :-( (Sorry Terry!) Are most people reading here reading in web or bbs format? I would rather compose in the format that is going to be most legible for most people. (Somehow, the Caucus people have got this problem solved in such a way that when in \"read\" mode when using the text version, the html tags are invisible.)"}, {"response": 11, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Sat, Jan  4, 1997 (17:19)", "body": "Terry: You're right topic and item are one and the same. We have the option of calling these things whatever we want. However, from the user's point of view, the lable used should be consistent. In this context, someone who did not know Caucus would not know whether \"item\" meant \"topic\" or \"response\". Terry: Caucus was superior in handling minimal abbreviations. You can enter *several* variants of a word and it works. For example, all these might work: c ch che chec check etc. Right - but when I tried using \"k\" for \"kill\" it did not work! I had to use the whole word, thought the list showed it as k_ill, telling the user that \"k\" alone would work. Terry: I use the 'n' command continually. So do I, in Caucus - it really needs to be in the web version! That could at least help with the \"no cache\" problem in that one could use \"n\" if one went to follow a link and return to the new items still marked as new. This would be a little more clear for \"freeze\": existing: stop any further responses to this item proposed prevent any further responses to this topic scr_ibble [#] - censor and scribble over a response This is very unclear; what is the difference between censoring with and without scribbling? In practice scribble ends up leaving the header there! Is there a reason why the header, too, doesn't go away? Terry: This is something I'd like to start using: reply [#] - send mail to the author of a response I wonder if this refers to unix mail or some kind of internal mail system like caucus, I'd be surprised if it was internal. It probably sends mail to whatever address is in the link in the header, though I have not actually tried it. Terry: This is designed to spare readers the trouble of reading a long response. They can have the option of seeing it if they want. scr_ibble [#] - censor and scribble over a response I don't think so - I think it removes the response for everyone. I say this because my web identity is still different from my shell identity and I \"scribbled\" a duplicate posting of mine from bbs, and when I looked in web, it was also gone - except for the header. So I don't think people can just scribble on their \"own\" copy - if they do it, it looks as if it will affect everyone. Terry: I would like to know the answer to this: tree - show diagram of response tree It slmost seems as if this: reply [#] - send mail to the author of a response is defined incorrectly. Perhaps reply [#] is supposed to mean reply to a specific response number (not e-mail) and that would create the tree? To reply via e-mail (at least in web version) one can just click on the address link. Ok: commands Invalid command: commands You have to type help commands I believe. Could be, but that is not what it is telling the user to do!"}, {"response": 12, "author": "terry", "date": "Sat, Jan  4, 1997 (23:25)", "body": "I hope you pass some of these thoughts along to Dave in the yapp conference."}, {"response": 13, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Sun, Jan  5, 1997 (01:34)", "body": "I do not know which are appropriate to pass along - I was assuming that most of the stuff such as editing descriptions of functions of commands was something that can and is done locally. Does yapp use the same \"dictionary\" type of system for defining online prompts as Caucus does? For a while there used to be a set of command \"dictionaries\" in 6 different foreign languages which could be selected by the users - as well as an extra terse and extra verbose English \"dictionary. We were able to edit these locally. (Unfortunately, nobody updated the foreign language versions after the new release of Caucus, so those are no longer useable, but it was kind of a kick to try to read the menus and help files in German or Italian, etc.) If it is appropriate to do so (i.e. not something that Dave would consider locally modifiable) I could easily plop the whole text above into the yapp conf."}, {"response": 14, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan  5, 1997 (09:48)", "body": "Joan which Caucus system were you (are you?) on?"}, {"response": 15, "author": "churchh", "date": "Sun, Jan  5, 1997 (13:35)", "body": "Joan -- I think the reason \"scribble\" doesn't entirely remove a message is because this would foul up the whole numbering scheme in that topic, and all the external counts of numbers of messages read by different users, etc... When you \"scribble\" a message, just replace the text of the message to be deleted with \"[Erroneous duplicate message deleted]\", or something like that... Also, the message \"tree\" -- I think this would be implemented using the lines beginning \",R\" in the _[0-9]* topic files; I notice these lines always read \",R0000\" now, but I assume they could be set to indicate which message some other message was in reply to. I have no idea HOW to enable this feature, or even whether it can be enabled for a single conference..."}, {"response": 16, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan  5, 1997 (13:55)", "body": "Henry, can you help me set up golftravel.net on barton.spring.com and set up Realaudio on barton.spring.com. Perhaps Myretta knows something about this?"}, {"response": 17, "author": "mrobens", "date": "Sun, Jan  5, 1997 (15:35)", "body": "Sorry, Terry. I have no experience with this."}, {"response": 18, "author": "churchh", "date": "Sun, Jan  5, 1997 (16:34)", "body": "Sorry Joan -- from all the references people let drop, I had assumed that scribble let you EDIT old messages, but I tried it out myself, and it seems to simply nuke their contents... The reasons I mentioned why a message isn't completely removed (in the sense of renumbering the following messages with lower numbers) remain valid, but it seems that with the Yapp scribble function, you have no control over what replaces it. So it seems you have to go back to the text editor to edit an old message; if you use pico to edit a raw topic file, be sure to start it up with the \"pico -w\" command-line option, to disable line-wrap, or you could really garble the file... Also, I was wrong about the ,R0000 line being to indicate a message is a reply to a specific previous message; instead it seems to indicate message \"status\" (a \"scribbled\" message is marked with ,R0003). I have no idea how threading would be implemented on Yapp. Amy, while I was gleefully \"scribbling\" messages 4,5,6 in topic 34 of the Austen conference (I've wanted to junk those for a long time now), I accidentally got rid of your message 3 in that topic; I went into the editor, and recreated it from memory. It's probably close enough, but you can go back and restore it in it's precise original form, if you have it somewhere, and consider it worthwhile..."}, {"response": 19, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Jan  5, 1997 (18:20)", "body": "] I accidentally got rid of your message 3 in that topic; I went into the editor, and recreated it from memory. It's probably close enough, but you can go back and restore it in it's precise original form, if you have it somewhere, and consider it worthwhile... __ I don't know to what you refer. But my guess would be is not worthwhile."}, {"response": 20, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Jan  5, 1997 (18:26)", "body": "] I don't know to what you refer. But my guess would be is not worthwhile. __ No. Not worth a thing. I must elevate myself."}, {"response": 21, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Sun, Jan  5, 1997 (20:32)", "body": "HC, if you have seen topic 9 in Austen, (is it 9? Help?) You'll see that I discovered that Cencor and Scribble appear to do exactly the same thing, but when I tried to edit in pico, it would not let me - said the file could not be opened for writing. How come it lets you but not me?"}, {"response": 22, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Sun, Jan  5, 1997 (20:39)", "body": "Regarding leaving the header there - I know the numbering structure would need to be left in tact, but other software (Caucus for example) removes the header from view and just leaves a gap in the numbering. Terry, I have an account on tmn which is the home of The Meta Net (Metasystems Design Group) who are part owners of Caucus. I do not wish to appear to be \"pushing\" Caucus - in fact, I don't particularly like it - chiefly because it is unthreaded. But as an exemplar of unthreaded conferencing software, it is quite well implemented, and since I have been a conference moderator/organizer for several years on an education network using Caucus software, I am fairly well aware of what can and cannot be done a d what the user has control over and what we have to beg Charles Roth to implement."}, {"response": 23, "author": "churchh", "date": "Mon, Jan  6, 1997 (05:51)", "body": "Joan -- why can't you edit a raw topic file with \"pico -w\"? Because the non-existent user \"winsor\" was added to the \"bbs\" group, instead of \"jwinsor\" -- look at the file etc/group"}, {"response": 24, "author": "mrobens", "date": "Mon, Jan  6, 1997 (06:25)", "body": "Joan, I have fixed this. You are now jwinsor in the bbs group. Try it again."}, {"response": 25, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Jan  6, 1997 (09:07)", "body": "So did you guys have an breakfast session on ownership? And I missed it? Did you at least save me a croissant?"}, {"response": 26, "author": "mrobens", "date": "Mon, Jan  6, 1997 (10:53)", "body": "No, but there's half a bagel left."}, {"response": 27, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Jan  6, 1997 (11:32)", "body": "Oh man, you guys. You mean that sickly looking little smashed up article with a piece of somebody's lipsticked napkin lingering on it. Please!"}, {"response": 28, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Mon, Jan  6, 1997 (19:27)", "body": "HC: ] \"with \"pico -w\"\" What is with this \"-w\" ??? It's a new one on me. Maybe it is no wrapping? HC: ] Because the non-existent user \"winsor\" was added to the \"bbs\" group, instead of \"jwinsor\" -- look at the file etc/group So now I am a nonexistent user - oh the indignity of it all! Myretta: ] Joan, I have fixed this. You are now jwinsor in the bbs group. Try it again. Thank you! The only place I am just plain \"winsor\" is on our schools' network and I am trying to talk Tomas into changing me to jwinsor. (Especially since my sister goes by plain \"winsor\".)"}, {"response": 29, "author": "churchh", "date": "Mon, Jan  6, 1997 (20:17)", "body": "Joan -- use \"pico -w\" to avoid line-wrapping which could garble a raw topics file as it is being edited...."}, {"response": 30, "author": "churchh", "date": "Thu, Jan  9, 1997 (07:31)", "body": ""}, {"response": 31, "author": "churchh", "date": "Thu, Jan  9, 1997 (07:32)", "body": ""}, {"response": 32, "author": "churchh", "date": "Thu, Jan  9, 1997 (07:33)", "body": "The reason Yapp was down on www.spring.com for about 15 minutes aroun 7:00 AM was because of a problem caused when I was changing the configuration to allow custom link colors in the austentest conference (there was an incompatibility between my browser and the configuration update script, so that \"\\n\\n\" in the rc.yapp-bin file was incorrectly changed to \"\\n\" -- I had to go into VI to fix this , so consider me appropriately punished ...)"}, {"response": 33, "author": "Amy", "date": "Thu, Jan  9, 1997 (07:51)", "body": "Speaking of /n's We would use another one or two in the topic creation process. Or an [hr] or something, I think, anyway. Though my taste in page layout and colors and things have been known to be questioned."}, {"response": 34, "author": "churchh", "date": "Thu, Jan  9, 1997 (15:07)", "body": "I finally looked at the PostScript Yapp manual in Amy's austen_admin directory on www.spring.com. I noticed nothing about threading, no word beginning with \"thread\" appears in the index, and what seems like it would be the most relevant section, \u00a74.3, is completely blank (\"This section to be filled in later\"). The image below is a screen dump of the section on Yapp variable syntax, and shows you the kind of thing one would probably have to deal with if one were to try to customize the buttons in one conference only..."}, {"response": 35, "author": "Amy", "date": "Thu, Jan  9, 1997 (16:43)", "body": "Oh Lord."}, {"response": 36, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Fri, Jan 10, 1997 (02:51)", "body": "HC: I had to go into VI to fix this , so consider me appropriately punished indeed! A fate worse than death! HC: I noticed nothing about threading, no word beginning with \"thread\" appears in the index,... It sounds more and more as if yapp is not even a \"real\" product yet - still half-baked, if that! Hope Terry is not paying for the privilege of doing all this beta testing for them!"}, {"response": 37, "author": "terry", "date": "Fri, Jan 10, 1997 (07:16)", "body": "Actually Terry is, it costs us a pretty penny. I owe Dave $1,000 still on yapp. But that's a subject for the budget/finances topic."}, {"response": 38, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Fri, Jan 10, 1997 (20:23)", "body": "I hate to sound harsh, but I see little to love in yapp - the shell implementation requires people to read around all of the html tags, wraps text awkwardly, has inaccurate online documentation and unimplemented \"features\", yet the most useful features are not even available to the web browser users, who must also put up with the no cache business, error messages given inappropriately, old-is-new attacks, unwanted paragraph breaks inserted into text and God knows what-all else - neither group of users has a viable option."}, {"response": 39, "author": "terry", "date": "Sat, Jan 11, 1997 (12:22)", "body": "If yapp isn't it, what do you recommend?"}, {"response": 40, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Sat, Jan 11, 1997 (21:44)", "body": "If yapp isn't it, what do you recommend? I'm not sure that the ideal exists - yet. Other conferencing software that I have used often enough to speak with any experience upon (other than Caucus) is all strictly text-based, and I would hate to give up the advantages of being able to use html. But yapp permits only very limited use of html with the already mentioned problems unsolved. Being able to follow links and return to the place where you left off is really essential! As I have said before, I really do not like Caucus/WebCaucus all that well, either, but at least it is well implemented, compared to yapp. At present, it is the only conferenceing software I have used that works in an integrated manner both in web and"}, {"response": 41, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Sat, Jan 11, 1997 (21:51)", "body": "Case in point! My text got chopped. And if I had typed my response in the text entry window instead of offline, it would now be completely gone and I would be exceedingly upset at having to re-create it all again! [and then I messed up a tag, and got the error message, and fixed it, and pressed the re-post button, and of course it did not re-post and the text was erased again - so I would not be typing it a 3rd time!] As I have said before, I really do not like Caucus/WebCaucus all that well, either, but at least it is well implemented, compared to yapp. At present, it is the only conferenceing software I have used that works in an integrated manner both in web and text formats. Does Dave actually claim that yapp is a finished product at this point? In practice, it seems much more like a work still in progress. And if so, he may actually wish us to give him a lot more feedback - but we get so little feedback from him that I have no idea what his views are on any of this. If he thinks it is finished, I would be looking for something else, because there are still so many things wrong with it, and I have not seen any evidence that he is serious about providing support. Think I shall e-mail a couple of people I know to see whether they have run across any other options."}, {"response": 42, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Sat, Jan 11, 1997 (21:54)", "body": "Well, it should have been \"would NOW have been typing\". (And of corse, the unwanted paragraph break in the middle of my paragraph is yet another illustration of things that need attending to.) Sorry, I don't mean to be gripe, gripe, griping all the time, but there is much that is frustrating to be dealt with in this software!"}, {"response": 43, "author": "terry", "date": "Sat, Jan 11, 1997 (22:23)", "body": "I actually like yapp better than caucus. We ran on caucus at the spring for the first year or so. In fact, we still have it archived. Caucus is even more expensive. The good thing about yapp is that Dave is very responsive to suggestions and the things that we don't like can be fixed if we communicate well enough with Dave in the yapp conference. I don't think Dave considers it a finished work. There are too many problems and limitations. But I feel like Dave is capable of making it a finished work in the near term. Please try and elucidate your concerns to Dave in yapp. If I had time, I would do a thorough QA on yapp and get a lot of these things fixed, but I have a very demanding job right now. Perhaps collectively we can do a QA on yapp and work with Dave to mold it into the interface that will serve us well."}, {"response": 44, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Jan 12, 1997 (00:59)", "body": "Terry, as long as this is a closed conference, I'll ask this. What is the deal with Yapp? Is Dave making any money from it? Does he wish to improve the web interface? Will he be responsive to our suggestions even though you have not paid him? Does he \"get\" our love for threading at all?"}, {"response": 45, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Sun, Jan 12, 1997 (03:05)", "body": "Terry: We ran on caucus at the spring for the first year or so. In fact, we still have it archived. Was this the new web version, or just the earlier text version? Terry: I actually like yapp better than caucus. In what ways? From the user viewpoint there seems to be very little difference other than that features that do not work in yapp do work in Caucus. Terry: Caucus is even more expensive. I'm sure this is true - I've heard this from others who have considered using it. Terry: I have a very demanding job right now. So do I! (And and am also doing some beta testing for a commercial developer of software for people with disabilities. Bugs are starting to get on my nerves!"}, {"response": 46, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Sun, Jan 12, 1997 (03:07)", "body": "Amy: Does he \"get\" our love for threading at all? I expect that even if he does, implementing true threading would mean going back to the drawing board. It is a totally different concept programmatically."}, {"response": 47, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Jan 12, 1997 (05:17)", "body": "different program ____ Quite true, but if we are to stick with this, I would very much like to see the linking aspects implemented."}, {"response": 48, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan 12, 1997 (08:27)", "body": "I owe Dave $1,000. I don't know how he feels about threading. This software is being used commercially at http://www.macworld.com and http://www.gamespot.com and is designed as a picospan/WELL Engaged clone so those other commercial sites with more traffic probably have more weight in influencing Dave. So far, Dave's Yapp 3.0 has been the best software I've seen for conferencing. WELL Engaged is more mature, but I would imagine the cost would be prohibitive, as would Caucus web edition. And Caucus doesn't support threaded conferencing either, at least it didn't the last time I looked. I feel like we could influence Dave more if this system became more popular and more successful financially. I'm working on several ways of generating revenues to help support the Spring, such as the Capitol City A&E project. Perhaps we could get some sponsorship at some point."}, {"response": 49, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Sun, Jan 12, 1997 (18:30)", "body": "Terry: And Caucus doesn't support threaded conferencing either, at least it didn't the last time I looked. Right - which is why I don't particularly like it. The authors are philosophically opposed to threading. This philosophy does lend itself well to \"business\" type discussion - requiring participants to read everything before responding - but online conferencing is not a one-size-fits-all situation. If one were invited to a party where they required all guests to gather in a big circle and speak one at a time, everyone would go home early - and turn down future invitations! .212.10/~amy/gsmile.gif\">"}, {"response": 50, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Sun, Jan 12, 1997 (18:58)", "body": "Terry, I tried to go to: http://www.macworld.com to see how it works there - but could not find anywhere that it was being used - except posibly what they called \"Message boards\" - but when I clicked that link, I got a server error. Do you know of a specific place on their site that yapp is running?"}, {"response": 51, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan 12, 1997 (19:53)", "body": "That was it! Must be down right now. Try again later. It's kind of buried on their site. Wish a had a specific url for you."}, {"response": 52, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Jan 12, 1997 (21:46)", "body": "I've been there Joan. The Mac people -- not surprisinbly -- find it \"not intuitive\" too."}, {"response": 53, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Mon, Jan 13, 1997 (00:14)", "body": "I've been there Joan. Did the things that don't work here also not work there?"}, {"response": 54, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan 13, 1997 (02:10)", "body": "I looked at http://www.gamespot.com and they are way behind us in interface development. Not much going on there all. And MacWorld returned a server error. Jeeez."}, {"response": 55, "author": "churchh", "date": "Mon, Jan 20, 1997 (13:49)", "body": "In response to past complaining from Amy, I changed the rc.yapp-bin configuration file so that, from now on, messages will have [A NAME=\"something\"] anchors inserted in their headers, which allows the possibility of linking to a specific message..."}, {"response": 56, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Jan 20, 1997 (15:08)", "body": "Wow!"}, {"response": 57, "author": "Amy", "date": "Thu, Feb 20, 1997 (08:15)", "body": "Cross posted from the help topic in Austen Topic 171 of 195: HELP! Topic 171 of 195 [austen]: HELP! Response 32 of 33: Amy (Amy) * Wed, Feb 19, 1997 (16:12) * 57 lines From the Yapp conference. Does not look like any of our troubles have yet been fixed. Topic 49 of 49: Release Information Tue, Feb 18, 1997 (22:04) | Kaylene Thaler (kaylene@armidale.ann-arbor.mi.us) The following is an update on added abilities, and bug fixes in the most recient versions of Yapp. *************** VERSION 3.0.14 ********************* Yapp now creates the partdir (participation directory) immediately. Previously, particpation directories could get trashed if they were being updated when the system crashed. Now particpation files are written atomically. From the WWW there was a malformed header error as a result of forgetting an item. This error has been fixed. There was an I/O bug on Solaris which has been fixed. The acl file now contains the proper information when a conference is created a file. If you enter a security number under the old system, the appropriate acl information is derived. The following have been added to Yapp: The commands `change cfjoin' and `display cfjoin'. Default .cflist, .cfrc, and .cfonce files are now allowed. The variables cancacl, canracl, canwacl, and canaacl have been added to allow checking for read/write/enter permissions to allow the web interface to be less ambiguous. ******************** VERSION 3.0.15 ********************* The bug in the acl file which allowed users to enter a responce when the acl file restriced who could respond has been fixed. Yapp was changed such that when you change a conference config file for a maillist conference, the maillist file is automatically updated. Mailing list conferences can now be linked to more than one mailing list. Line 6 of the conference config file can now contain comma separated email addresses. ********************* Future Release Information ********* In up and comming releases, the numbering system for Yapp will change. Any new functionality will have a 3.1.X number, and only bug fixes for current functions will follow the 3.0.X numbering scheme. If you want to follow the most recent developments follow the 3.1.X scheme. If you want stable code follow the 3.0.X Your current Yapp license will still be valid for both the 3.0.X and the 3.1.X schemes. numbering. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Topic 171 of 195 [austen]: HELP! Response 33 of 33: Myretta (mrobens) * Thu, Feb 20, 1997 (06:51) * 11 lines VERSION 3.0.15 The bug in the acl file which allowed users to enter a responce when the acl file restriced who could respond has been fixed. --------------------------------------- This may fix the austenarchive problem that I had to force. Have we been upgraded to this version? Should we test it?"}, {"response": 58, "author": "Amy", "date": "Thu, Feb 20, 1997 (08:18)", "body": "VERSION 3.0.15 The bug in the acl file which allowed users to enter a responce when the acl file restriced who could respond has been fixed. --------------------------------------- This may fix the austenarchive problem that I had to force. Have we been upgraded to this version? Should we test it? __ I don't know. I can't see how the ACL file works with the rc and config and have not bothered to see what does what. As to the new version... Terry? I put this over here because I wondered if payment for the software is an issue and did not want to talk about it to the whole Austen crowd."}, {"response": 59, "author": "terry", "date": "Sat, Feb 22, 1997 (23:53)", "body": "It's an issue. I have to raise $1000 to get the upgrade. I'm working on ways to do this. Unless there's something better? How are y'all feeling about yapp?"}, {"response": 60, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Sun, Feb 23, 1997 (02:50)", "body": "\"How are y'all feeling about yapp?' My opinion is that it still has some serious bugs/problems which it should not ever have been allowed out of beta with - and which do not appear to have been addressed in any of the announced fixes yet. However, I have not had time personally to investigate the alternatives. (Nor am I likely to in the immediate future.)"}, {"response": 61, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Feb 23, 1997 (06:17)", "body": "I'd feel kind of bad about dumping it after all we've done to try to work with it. And a little guilty about any time Dave may have spent trying to accomodate us -- though that concern is more than outweighed by a belief that we've put this thing through its paces for him."}, {"response": 62, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Feb 23, 1997 (06:18)", "body": "But! If we switch. Let's think threading!"}, {"response": 63, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Feb 23, 1997 (14:03)", "body": "Before we dump yapp, we need to think about setting up a new system on access.spring.com. Most of the new conferencing systems are detailed on the site previously mentioned (the name escapes me at the moment, David Wooley I believe)."}, {"response": 64, "author": "terry", "date": "Sat, Mar  1, 1997 (12:04)", "body": "If you have binaries for Yapp version 3.0.13, 3.0.14 or 3.0.15 you will experiece problems with your license file if yapp is accessed from the web 100 or more times in a given day. You can determine which version you are running from the yapp debug pages, or by looking at the version listed when executing bbs from Unix. The bug changes your regular license into an evaluation license. You can check your license file and determine if it has changed to an evaluation license by looking for any information after line 4 (the checksum). If there is anything after line 4 and you shouldn't have an evaluation license, you will need to upgrade to Yapp 3.0.16. Yapp 3.0.16 has the license bug fixed, and no new features. Yapp 3.0.16 is available from ftp:\\\\armidale.ann-arbor.mi.us/pub/yapp for FreeBSD and Solaris. If you need to have it compiled for another operating system let us know. from kaylene thaler"}, {"response": 65, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sat, Mar  1, 1997 (12:38)", "body": "We have 3.0.10"}, {"response": 66, "author": "terry", "date": "Sat, Mar  1, 1997 (12:48)", "body": "We may have to upgrade then."}, {"response": 67, "author": "mrobens", "date": "Sat, Mar  1, 1997 (22:47)", "body": "3.0.10 looks like it's pre-bug deeper conference Main Menu"}]}, {"num": 13, "subject": "bastrop.net", "response_count": 3, "posts": [{"response": 1, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (12:10)", "body": "Bastrop Internet Services http://www.bastrop.net Rt 1 Box 564 Cedar Creek TX 78612 Scott Holman mailto://administrator@mail.bastrop.net Jeffrey Boe mailto://webmaster@mail.bastrop.net"}, {"response": 2, "author": "terry", "date": "Sat, Jan  4, 1997 (08:07)", "body": "We're looking into getting a dedicated line to these folks from the Spring offices."}, {"response": 3, "author": "terry", "date": "Wed, Jan 22, 1997 (05:44)", "body": "I now have a dedicated dial up to bastrop.net. This computer I'm on in Cedar Creek is now online 24 hours a day. I'm building and NT server but I'm having hardware problems. deeper conference Main Menu"}]}, {"num": 14, "subject": "Do we need chat", "response_count": 4, "posts": [{"response": 1, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (21:24)", "body": "Private rooms might be nice, Terry. Something the Austen people might use in addition to the Drawing Room."}, {"response": 2, "author": "Amy", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (06:26)", "body": "Also on chat, I want to work with Kaff to set up a system for events like the ball, trivia games and guest appearances. The author of the new Darcy book would be a good person to invite and practice on. I would like to set up something like what AOL does, where questions are fed to a sort of producer type person, almost like on a radio talk show, screened and fed to the guest or celebrity."}, {"response": 3, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (11:47)", "body": "That seems possible Amy. I would just need to have the script send everything as a private message to the moderator - with the moderator and the guest being the only ones with permission to post a public message. It would take a little tinkering, but should be possible."}, {"response": 4, "author": "terry", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (22:47)", "body": "Should we have a chat system here on the Spring? If so, which one? What does your ideal chat system do? Have you seen ichat? http://www.ichat.com Or do you like the Pemberly chat room format best? deeper conference Main Menu"}]}, {"num": 15, "subject": "mail on the Spring and mailing lists", "response_count": 11, "posts": [{"response": 1, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (20:21)", "body": "If you have an account on the Spring you need to set up a .forward file in your user directory. If you haven't done it, set up a .forward file if you don't pick up your mail here. And here's how: cat > .forward yourname@spring.com ^D now exit the account and send a test message to your account, then check your own email address for that message. A better form is this (I'm using the example of my account): My .forward file: \\terry,terry@www.spring.com For example, Amy's email is amylou@bluemarble.net and hers would be: \\amy,amylous@bluemarble.net"}, {"response": 2, "author": "terry", "date": "Tue, Jan  7, 1997 (07:37)", "body": "* very important * If you notice mail is down on the Spring and you have root access, *please* run the following command to restart it. It works, I just did it. /usr/sbin/sendmail -bd -q30m This starts the sendmail daemon. This command is included in the system boot scripts, I believe, but it's too drastic to restart the whole system just to get mail going. Does anyone know how to set up mail aliases? Look at the aliases file. I like to set up a couple for our two email groups in the austen conference. Glad mail is running. I didn't find out about out till 12 hours after it went down on spring.com. Amy you have an account as 'amy' on spring.com and we need to get the others set up there also. Who will volunteer to set up these accounts (as Amy is busy the next few days)."}, {"response": 3, "author": "mrobens", "date": "Tue, Jan  7, 1997 (08:34)", "body": "Terry, Do I use the newalias program for this? I'll be glad to do it."}, {"response": 4, "author": "terry", "date": "Tue, Jan  7, 1997 (10:05)", "body": "I'm not sure. Read the man page on alias if there is one. We found someone to help with realaudio. Can you work with him?"}, {"response": 5, "author": "mrobens", "date": "Thu, Jan  9, 1997 (12:26)", "body": ""}, {"response": 6, "author": "mrobens", "date": "Thu, Jan  9, 1997 (12:28)", "body": "I have set up two aliases: austen_com and austen_unix. They contain the email addresses of the two Austen Conference groups. They have not been tested."}, {"response": 7, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan 13, 1997 (05:24)", "body": "Have you tested them yet?"}, {"response": 8, "author": "mrobens", "date": "Mon, Jan 13, 1997 (07:10)", "body": "Have you tested them yet? Yes and they don't work. When I have a minute, I'll try to figure out why."}, {"response": 9, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan 13, 1997 (16:24)", "body": "Tahnks!!! (I can't get to a machine with speakers here at work)."}, {"response": 10, "author": "mrobens", "date": "Wed, Jan 15, 1997 (08:10)", "body": "OK. I've created two mail ailiases: austen_com and austen_unix. These expeand to the mail lists on Amy's comittee page. These work with ELM but not with the mail command. Which is exactly what the man page on newalias said, if I'd been paying attention. What next?"}, {"response": 11, "author": "terry", "date": "Wed, Jan 29, 1997 (06:08)", "body": "We now have access to our mailing list thanks to Dave. Roughly a third of the email addresses are false because users didn't replace the default they were assigned with their real email addresses. This is a problem that Dave is addressing in the next release of Yapp. From the yapp conference yesterday: Topic 44 of 45: 'Austen conference at Spring' Response 3 of 4: Henry (churchyh@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu) Tue, Jan 28, 1997 (11:39) 5 lines A lot of the e-mail addresses for web users at our site are bogus, because the default choice that's presented to them is the concatenation of: The user name they're choosing to be known as here + \"@\" + the result of running reverse DNS lookup on the IP address they're coming in from There probably isn't any better way to construct such a default, but unfortunately an e-mail address constructed according to this procedure will be bogus in many cases, and a lot of people don't bother to edit the default... So the result is that there's a lot of bogus pseudo-addresses of the general type \" MickJagger@dial-in-ppp42-9.custmax.ms.uu.net \", or whatever... Response 4 of 4: Dave Thaler (thaler@armidale.ann-arbor.mi.us) Tue, Jan 28, 1997 (19:20) 18 lines This is the purpose of the \"Participants\" button which should be at the top of the page of the list of topics in the conference. By default, this shows the login, last time on, and full name (but not email address) of the participant. A host can change this by putting a command in the conference rc file which redefines the \"partmsg\" variable to look like anything you want. For example, def partmsg '%10v %o %20u %{email}' will show the login, last time on, full name, and email address. If you just want a list of email addresses of conference members yourself, you could generate this in Unix and save it to a file from in Yapp with: def partmsg '%{email}' participants > filename -Dave deeper conference Main Menu"}]}, {"num": 17, "subject": "stats", "response_count": 2, "posts": [{"response": 1, "author": "terry", "date": "Tue, Dec 31, 1996 (00:19)", "body": "Here's an interesting stat, the daily hits for yapp (just yapp, not the whole website): www# cat usagelog Fri Jun 14: 48 Sat Jun 15: 101 Sun Jun 16: 29 Mon Jun 17: 97 Tue Jun 18: 66 Wed Jun 19: 165 Thu Jun 20: 72 Fri Jun 21: 7 Sat Jun 22: 45 Sun Jun 23: 34 Mon Jun 24: 12 Wed Jun 26: 60 Thu Jun 27: 96 Fri Jun 28: 10 Sat Jun 29: 27 Sun Jun 30: 25 Mon Jul 1: 89 Tue Jul 2: 69 Wed Jul 3: 86 Thu Jul 4: 93 Fri Jul 5: 220 Sat Jul 6: 172 Sun Jul 7: 131 Mon Jul 8: 506 Tue Jul 9: 1600 Wed Jul 10: 175 Thu Jul 11: 239 Fri Jul 12: 77 Sat Jul 13: 185 Sun Jul 14: 84 Mon Jul 15: 149 Tue Jul 16: 40 Wed Jul 17: 84 Thu Jul 18: 421 Fri Jul 19: 96 Sat Jul 20: 63 Sun Jul 21: 46 Mon Jul 22: 171 Tue Jul 23: 286 Wed Jul 24: 152 Thu Jul 25: 328 Fri Jul 26: 220 Sat Jul 27: 33 Sat Jul 27: 1 system down this day Mon Jul 29: 44 Tue Jul 30: 61 Wed Jul 31: 81 Thu Aug 1: 14 Fri Aug 2: 167 Sat Aug 3: 38 Sun Aug 4: 69 Mon Aug 5: 121 Tue Aug 6: 255 Wed Aug 7: 75 Thu Aug 8: 616 Fri Aug 9: 1600 our first big day! Sat Aug 10: 21 Sun Aug 11: 1599 Mon Aug 12: 1448 Tue Aug 13: 1227 Wed Aug 14: 1340 Thu Aug 15: 1073 Fri Aug 16: 784 Sat Aug 17: 867 Sun Aug 18: 952 Mon Aug 19: 829 Tue Aug 20: 897 Wed Aug 21: 902 Thu Aug 22: 844 Fri Aug 23: 833 Sat Aug 24: 686 Sun Aug 25: 923 Mon Aug 26: 881 Tue Aug 27: 889 Wed Aug 28: 761 Thu Aug 29: 952 Fri Aug 30: 1003 Sat Aug 31: 557 Sun Sep 1: 696 Mon Sep 2: 1150 Tue Sep 3: 1000 Wed Sep 4: 943 Thu Sep 5: 1070 Fri Sep 6: 919 Sat Sep 7: 483 Sun Sep 8: 381 Mon Sep 9: 481 Tue Sep 10: 548 Wed Sep 11: 517 Thu Sep 12: 692 Fri Sep 13: 949 Sat Sep 14: 1005 Sun Sep 15: 906 Mon Sep 16: 919 Tue Sep 17: 934 Wed Sep 18: 785 Thu Sep 19: 659 Fri Sep 20: 840 Sat Sep 21: 760 Sun Sep 22: 596 Mon Sep 23: 944 Tue Sep 24: 943 Wed Sep 25: 875 Thu Sep 26: 1131 Fri Sep 27: 1123 Sat Sep 28: 933 Sun Sep 29: 679 Mon Sep 30: 608 Tue Oct 1: 570 Wed Oct 2: 648 Thu Oct 3: 776 Fri Oct 4: 723 Sat Oct 5: 886 Sun Oct 6: 967 Mon Oct 7: 696 Tue Oct 8: 653 Wed Oct 9: 351 Thu Oct 10: 455 Thu Oct 17: 457 Fri Oct 18: 699 Sat Oct 19: 879 Sun Oct 20: 610 Mon Oct 21: 467 Tue Oct 22: 589 Wed Oct 23: 718 Thu Oct 24: 721 Fri Oct 25: 487 Sat Oct 26: 454 Sun Oct 27: 536 Mon Oct 28: 812 Tue Oct 29: 753 Wed Oct 30: 925 Thu Oct 31: 878 Fri Nov 1: 526 Sat Nov 2: 468 Sun Nov 3: 751 Mon Nov 4: 743 Tue Nov 5: 511 Wed Nov 6: 787 Thu Nov 7: 780 Fri Nov 8: 995 Sat Nov 9: 857 Sun Nov 10: 760 Mon Nov 11: 783 Tue Nov 12: 825 Wed Nov 13: 940 Thu Nov 14: 815 Fri Nov 15: 725 Sat Nov 16: 721 Sun Nov 17: 807 Mon Nov 18: 805 Tue Nov 19: 780 Wed Nov 20: 1135 Thu Nov 21: 945 Fri Nov 22: 4077 a huge increase on this day! Sat Nov 23: 4002 Sun Nov 24: 4103 Mon Nov 25: 4028 Tue Nov 26: 3954 Wed Nov 27: 3850 Thu Nov 28: 2859 Fri Nov 29: 3369 Sat Nov 30: 3056 Sun Dec 1: 3392 Mon Dec 2: 2168 Tue Dec 3: 2482 Wed Dec 4: 3671 Thu Dec 5: 4721 Fri Dec 6: 4156 Sat Dec 7: 2857 Sun Dec 8: 3107 Mon Dec 9: 3584 Tue Dec 10: 4221 Wed Dec 11: 4630 Thu Dec 12: 4202 Fri Dec 13: 4623 Sat Dec 14: 3221 Sun Dec 15: 3434 Mon Dec 16: 4449 Tue Dec 17: 4547 Wed Dec 18: 3148 Thu Dec 19: 2904 Fri Dec 20: 2922 Sat Dec 21: 3283 Sun Dec 22: 2467 Mon Dec 23: 3161 Tue Dec 24: 2162 Wed Dec 25: 1436 Christmas Day Thu Dec 26: 2279 Fri Dec 27: 2932 Sat Dec 28: 2558 Sun Dec 29: 3297 Mon Dec 30: 3540 Notice the upward progression? I'd like to see the stats on apps vs. austen! That's where we have the most traffic and hits."}, {"response": 2, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan 13, 1997 (05:25)", "body": "Any comments on this? deeper conference Main Menu"}]}, {"num": 18, "subject": "Austen general", "response_count": 7, "posts": [{"response": 1, "author": "Amy", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (06:41)", "body": "Joan, ask for help on this job. It looks like a big one. For example, would you like to recruit someone to do email to the committee members explaining the switch in venue (from email to deeper)."}, {"response": 2, "author": "terry", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (22:48)", "body": "I think we can move ahead more quickly by compiling all our thoughts in one place, here for now by default or whatever we can all agree upon."}, {"response": 3, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (23:19)", "body": "I have it all ready to go, but would really rather have it in the test conference - then testing of things peopel bring up can be tried and looked at right there. and we do not have to worry about who can or can not get in."}, {"response": 4, "author": "terry", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (23:23)", "body": "Sure."}, {"response": 5, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Sat, Jan  4, 1997 (03:48)", "body": "[But it won't let us make any noew topics. :-( ]"}, {"response": 6, "author": "terry", "date": "Sat, Jan  4, 1997 (08:09)", "body": "I'll test it. It's the 'test' conference?"}, {"response": 7, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sat, Jan  4, 1997 (09:46)", "body": "Right. austentest actually. deeper conference Main Menu"}]}, {"num": 2, "subject": "secure chat", "response_count": 189, "posts": [{"response": 1, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (09:54)", "body": "Good morning everyone! The next scheduled chat is at noon Austin time today (Sunday 12/29/96)."}, {"response": 2, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (10:11)", "body": "You can use this topic just like a chat room. If you're in Netscape control-r will refresh your screen. When this topic gets to full we'll archive it and renew it."}, {"response": 3, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (12:11)", "body": "I'm here on schedule. Is anyone here?"}, {"response": 4, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (14:22)", "body": "Guess not."}, {"response": 5, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (19:58)", "body": "OK. You all went to NetMeeting! Meet here at 10!"}, {"response": 6, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (21:57)", "body": "Terry, I couldn't get CoolEdit. You said they had been having problems with their FTP? Kaff got it today, though. Why don't we try to keep tonight's discussion to the Children's story site. There are lots of other things we need to talk about -- like, you wanted me to remind you to get superuser status for Myretta -- but when you work this way, I think it is easier to tackle one thing at a time."}, {"response": 7, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (21:59)", "body": "Questions about childrens story. Is it profit or non profit? Why do they want to accomplish. Any written goals or anything we could see to get an idea of what the aim is? Target ages?"}, {"response": 8, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:03)", "body": "I'm here!"}, {"response": 9, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:04)", "body": "Hi Kaff."}, {"response": 10, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:04)", "body": "Let's hope we all end up in the same place this time! :)"}, {"response": 11, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:05)", "body": "Let's hope we all end up in the same place this time! :)"}, {"response": 12, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:05)", "body": "Children's story is profit. It's Jonathon Langley's site that he's prototyping for an IBM project."}, {"response": 13, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:06)", "body": "I need to get a better handle on the TV-PC site. I guess it is content especially suited for set top boxes, supported by advertising? I need to go get a demo of a Magnovox unit or something so I can see what is able to be viewed on those things."}, {"response": 14, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:07)", "body": "Supported by advertising. Prototpye funded by IBM. Excuse my ignorance. Johnathon is who?"}, {"response": 15, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:07)", "body": "You don't really need a set top box. But keep in mind the area is 512 pixesl I believe instead of the usual 640 wide."}, {"response": 16, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:09)", "body": "No I don't want to buy one. But I would be curious to go see one in a store. See what regular web pages look like, and how this lower rez way of preparing grpahics helps the viewability."}, {"response": 17, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:09)", "body": "Ah, smaller than usual - I guess because TVs are bigger, I was thinking the viewing area would be larger."}, {"response": 18, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:10)", "body": "No it's smaller."}, {"response": 19, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:12)", "body": "As to the Children's site: I am assuming that what you would want from Amy and I is to find public domain stories and illustrations, to create web pages using them, plus including realAudio readings of the stories. What browser/plug-ins are included on Web TV?"}, {"response": 20, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:13)", "body": "Terry, did you submit a proposal or anything? Or what more can you tell us about what they expect. Who it's for, etc."}, {"response": 21, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:17)", "body": "I am looking at TVPC. The other sections are mostly links now. It doesn't look like there is much custom content, like the Childrens story section would be,"}, {"response": 22, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:19)", "body": "So this is in Austin. I am looking at the local page. Plans for expansion? What is IBM's involvement? Fill us in Terry!"}, {"response": 23, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:20)", "body": "What is Austen 360, Terry? Is it related or just linked?"}, {"response": 24, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:22)", "body": "I haven't looked at the TVPC page - I'll go check it out now."}, {"response": 25, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:23)", "body": "And Matrix Solutions. That is Jonathon?"}, {"response": 26, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:25)", "body": "Austin 360 is the local newspapers site, I did some work on it in the early stages."}, {"response": 27, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:26)", "body": "Jonathon is tvpc and childrens stories."}, {"response": 28, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:26)", "body": "Matrix Solutions is a friend of his at IBM who did the java and frames after we did the basic content."}, {"response": 29, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:27)", "body": "Okay, so right now it is mostly links, but custom stuff is being developed for the various sections, and you have contracted to do just the children's story section. Right?"}, {"response": 30, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:28)", "body": "Okay, it is beginning to come together. Forgive me, Terry, but I always like to know how big the picture is and where I fit in."}, {"response": 31, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:31)", "body": "Correct. We're just doing that piece now. And we have Jonathon's machines connected to our T-1s at Prismnet and at Bastrop."}, {"response": 32, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:32)", "body": "So the first need to to get more stories up. Any guidelines about target age. Like, could we do the Alice books? It is in public domain and there are illustrations available for it too. That could become important. The illustrations up now, are those custom drawings? Who did the proto design? Any idea why she is not continuing?"}, {"response": 33, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:33)", "body": "Prismnet. That is a new name."}, {"response": 34, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:34)", "body": "I have written a little about etexts for Prodigy, so I know the sites and where to get the texts and a little about fair use."}, {"response": 35, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:34)", "body": "See the topic in this conference about Prismnet. They supply access.spring.com, barton.spring.com and www.spring.com with T-1 access."}, {"response": 36, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:36)", "body": "What kind of budget are we talking about? I assume we need a professional reader. That's why I thought of my actress friend, who would come cheap but not free."}, {"response": 37, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:36)", "body": "There's also Project Gutenberg. Henry seems to have done a pretty good job with the Jane Austen texts."}, {"response": 38, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:37)", "body": "Okay, on Prism. Terry, don't get annoyed with all my questions. I just like to know."}, {"response": 39, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:37)", "body": "I also spoke to my friend and she would be interested as well. How many stories are we looking for?"}, {"response": 40, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:38)", "body": "Henry is great with text. Knows AWK. He might want to help but I doubt he would take on the project as a whole."}, {"response": 41, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:39)", "body": "See the budget topic in this conference. If you need more than what is in the budget for a particular project, I have to go to the client with a new proposal, which I'll be happy to do. Jonathon is flexible as long as I don't bill him more than $600-$700 in a single billing. I have $750 coming from Texaltel for the prototype site (legislator)."}, {"response": 42, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:40)", "body": "Which is more urgent, Terry? IS either place starting to bug you to get going?"}, {"response": 43, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:40)", "body": "Jonathon hasn't said how many. He's looking for us to take this by the horns and provide him with guidance. There are a few hundred illustrations we can use that I ftped to the site from a CD that he gave me."}, {"response": 44, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:43)", "body": "Both are about equal. I'd like to get them both done next week and bill out about $1,500, part of which has to go for paying Prismnet and Bastrop IS and the Internic."}, {"response": 45, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:44)", "body": "What is the URL for the illustrations? Do you have any clue how much he expects per $750 hit?"}, {"response": 46, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:44)", "body": "The budget I put up in the topic is a tentative projection. Not a final statement. But it should be useful to get a better idea of the financing."}, {"response": 47, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:45)", "body": "So the children's story thing is ongoing. Some stories this month you can bill for right away, then more later? How about the legislator's thing? A one-shot?"}, {"response": 48, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:48)", "body": "Terry, I guess Kaff and I need to talk and see how much time we have immediately and kind of figure out the steps and time involved. I can work on it this week. Have one writing assignment also but it is not all consuming, unless I let it become so, as I am wont to do. ; )"}, {"response": 49, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:49)", "body": "I'm going to slip into the shower for about 10-15 mins. Y'all carry on ok."}, {"response": 50, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:50)", "body": "That sounds like a good idea. But I need something pretty soon on both sites. Figure out your compensation plan and try to fit it into the budgetary constraints. Look at the finance topic here in 'deeper'."}, {"response": 51, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:51)", "body": "I'm off work until the 6th, and have plenty of free time. Re: The stories that have already been done - Would you allow some redesign?"}, {"response": 52, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:52)", "body": "So when you say he is looking for guidance, that means maybe there isn't a plan for target ages and such? Well, I guess my mom experience shall come in handy. Another easy way to get up some content would be to do a links page, as I think you mentioned. Actually Alilce in Wonderland is already in HTML, so maybe a way to get a jump start on the site would be to do the links page first. It seems that is the evolutionary pattern for the other sections. Has he had any luck attracting advertisers? Or is he waiting for more,/better content befor pitching it much?"}, {"response": 53, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:52)", "body": "The legislators thing will be ongoing. There will be about 200 or so websites generated along the line. Each new one will be cookie cuttered from the prototype. Perhaps we could set up a form that the legislators could fill in on the website and then we could copy it in to the webpages."}, {"response": 54, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:53)", "body": "redesign would be good on what's been done to date."}, {"response": 55, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:53)", "body": "Amy - If Terry's taking off for a few, would you like to move to the Solicitor's office - its a little easier to chat with."}, {"response": 56, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:53)", "body": "Okay, Kaff should we sign off too and think about this?"}, {"response": 57, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:54)", "body": "He's waiting for more and better content but he wants to put up ads anyway to show the idea. We can give away some free ads for the time being."}, {"response": 58, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:54)", "body": "Will you be up for a while? I need to check on my houseguest. I am being terribly neglectful."}, {"response": 59, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:55)", "body": "Why not talk it up here then I could catch up when I get out of the shower."}, {"response": 60, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:56)", "body": "I'll be back in a while. I don't know how late I'll be up. I have to get up early and go to work."}, {"response": 61, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:56)", "body": "I am ready to go, Terry. Kaff can we say we'll have a rough plan by tomorrow night for this month's work on childrens story at least?"}, {"response": 62, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:56)", "body": "I'll be up. I have to admit, I think this will be fun - and I'm certain we can get some good content started in a week."}, {"response": 63, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:57)", "body": "] I have to get up early and go to work. ___ It's going alright, though, Terry? How is going to the office everyday suiting you?"}, {"response": 64, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:57)", "body": "Yes. I'll probably stick around in Pemberley tonight. If you want to stop by we can move over the office."}, {"response": 65, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:58)", "body": "You build the plan, I'll print it and run it by Jonathon's. Remember: look good on a tv use the gifs we have (several hundred) do at least a few samples of real aduio with much more projected. encorporate some ads."}, {"response": 66, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:58)", "body": "Okay. We'll talk in 45 minutes or so. Then, Terry, we'll do another 3-way somewhere tomorrow night? What is a good time for you? 8/7?"}, {"response": 67, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:58)", "body": "That's a good time. Ten is ok too."}, {"response": 68, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:59)", "body": "Be back in a bit..."}, {"response": 69, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (22:59)", "body": "\"use the gifs we have (several hundred)\" Can I alter them at all?"}, {"response": 70, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (23:00)", "body": "What's better for you tomorrow Kaff? I will catch up with you in the Drawing Room in a little bit."}, {"response": 71, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (23:00)", "body": "Perhaps y'all could read the other topics and pose some questions or add some comments. And make some project topics for austen.com if you like!"}, {"response": 72, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (23:01)", "body": "You can alter them. They're at childrenstory. There's also http://www.spring.com/~child I think they're there too. I'll email Amy the password and set her up with su. be back in a bit... I'm gone for now."}, {"response": 73, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (23:01)", "body": "Okay Terry, tomorrow night, then if not sooner. 8/7 or 11/10 either is okay for me just somebody let me know which. Gotta go."}, {"response": 74, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (23:02)", "body": "Anytime in the evening is fine with me."}, {"response": 75, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (23:02)", "body": "Okay - lets do 11/10 tomorrow night. See you here!"}, {"response": 76, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:09)", "body": "Here, I will just tidy up the conference table here while I wair for you too. Nobody here drinks decaf, do they? Would that not be insupportable?"}, {"response": 77, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:12)", "body": "Decaf Diet Pepsi, please. :)"}, {"response": 78, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:12)", "body": "Questions I did not put in our little plan: Where is the RealAudio server? Got us on root status now? Okay to use images other than the gifs in the directory here? Kaff, it seems like there was something else."}, {"response": 79, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:13)", "body": "Oh Kaff. No Jolt?"}, {"response": 80, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:14)", "body": "Only if he needs this completed by tomorrow morning! [G]"}, {"response": 81, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:15)", "body": "Terry! Terry? Are you in NetMeeting?"}, {"response": 82, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:24)", "body": "No sign of Terry yet? Perhaps we should e-mail him?"}, {"response": 83, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:24)", "body": "5 more minutes, Kaff? Terry if we take off, maybe you can just comment on the plan in email to both of us."}, {"response": 84, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:24)", "body": "I'm here."}, {"response": 85, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:25)", "body": "I sent one about 5 minutes ago."}, {"response": 86, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:26)", "body": "Hi Terry."}, {"response": 87, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:26)", "body": "Hi Amy and Kaff. Who all's here?"}, {"response": 88, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:27)", "body": "Just us again, Terry. We want to get all nailed down on the childrenstory thing first. Myretta has some questions about root and Yapp. We might want to arrange to do that tomorrow if you will be available."}, {"response": 89, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:28)", "body": "Hi Terry! Its just the three of us, I believe."}, {"response": 90, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:31)", "body": "Terry, you got my mail proposing what we want to do as initial steps?"}, {"response": 91, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:35)", "body": "I haven't read my mail tonight. Right now I'm exhausted."}, {"response": 92, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:36)", "body": "Let's do this another time, then. We really just wanted reaction to that and a go ahead. Can't think when you are tired."}, {"response": 93, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:37)", "body": "I really enjoyed visiting kaf's web sites, esp. the Antonio Banderas one. That was nice! No it's ok... I'm going to drink some caffiene."}, {"response": 94, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:38)", "body": "er, caffeine."}, {"response": 95, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:38)", "body": "Okay. I''ll go make a pot too. 5 minutes?"}, {"response": 96, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:39)", "body": "I'm reading your email."}, {"response": 97, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:39)", "body": "Thanks Terry! Amy's got the Jolt..."}, {"response": 98, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:41)", "body": "My mail is loading in now in another window."}, {"response": 99, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:42)", "body": "Now how did I do that? Response to number 2? Interesting huh?"}, {"response": 100, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:43)", "body": "I don't see your email. Just the two about chown problems."}, {"response": 101, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:44)", "body": "Will this say response to 99?"}, {"response": 102, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:45)", "body": "I typed r 101 at the ok prompt and this is what happens. Interesting new trick."}, {"response": 103, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:49)", "body": "Amy can you resend it? kaf are you still here?"}, {"response": 104, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:52)", "body": "I don't understand r. Dave mentioned it can be done at the prompt, but I don't get how it works. Did he ever say if he would be able to incorporate it -- however it works --- into the new web version? I will resend the plan, Terry."}, {"response": 105, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:53)", "body": "I'm still here..."}, {"response": 106, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:54)", "body": "Sent"}, {"response": 107, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:54)", "body": "I'm at the shell in unix. I just put you and myretta into the right group like I told you in my email today. Did you find the ra files (realaudio)?"}, {"response": 108, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:56)", "body": "Yes, but I have to play around with them more -- all I could hear was static when I tried to play them locally. I wonder if they need to be unencoded or something? I have to get way more up on sound. Got Cool Edit and it records pretty well."}, {"response": 109, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:56)", "body": "] you and myretta into the right group __ Kaff, too. Terry. If you please."}, {"response": 110, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:57)", "body": "Did you send it to: mailto://terry@spring.com ?"}, {"response": 111, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:58)", "body": "I'll add kaf now."}, {"response": 112, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:58)", "body": "Terry did you see my note on Myretta's other request -- that she needs the cfadm PW too?"}, {"response": 113, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:59)", "body": "Go ahead and give it to her. That's ok."}, {"response": 114, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (22:59)", "body": "] I'll add kaf now. ___ Thanks!"}, {"response": 115, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:02)", "body": "Oh. the PW you gave me for Yapp will give her that privilege. I took at look at the stuff that can be done in a browser -- all pretty global things. All the conference specific stuff must be done in UnIX apparently. But, Terry. Can we settle on the childrenstory stuff since it is getting so late?"}, {"response": 116, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:02)", "body": "Amy, have you made any changes to it? If not, I could try to send it."}, {"response": 117, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:04)", "body": "I'm still waiting for that email. Can you post it in the topic for that in this conference or resend the email?"}, {"response": 118, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:07)", "body": "The best process would be to do somehting small at first to show the direction you're doing. I talked to Jonathon today. I'd like to see what you're proposing but it's not in my email yet."}, {"response": 119, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:08)", "body": "Kaff, maybe you should try. I can log off and try my other account too. Sorry. My mailer says it has gone twice."}, {"response": 120, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:09)", "body": "Willem Dafoe is on Jay Leno right now talking about the English Patient."}, {"response": 121, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:09)", "body": "Terry - I just tried sending it."}, {"response": 122, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:14)", "body": "They're showing clips now of the English Patient."}, {"response": 123, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:15)", "body": "Terry - Have you received my e-mail?"}, {"response": 124, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:15)", "body": "It's here now an dI'm reading it."}, {"response": 125, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:17)", "body": "It looks good. I hope you can do it in an evolutionary way, I'd like to do a billing at the end of this week and get this phase over."}, {"response": 126, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:18)", "body": "I just sent it again too."}, {"response": 127, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:20)", "body": "I don't know why not. Kaff is off work. And I have only part of one small writing assignment to do this week. Terry, must we use the illustrations in the dir here? Is teh RA server on this machine?"}, {"response": 128, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:21)", "body": "I'll go look and find out, just a minute."}, {"response": 129, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:24)", "body": "barton:/usr/local/realaudio ls -rlt total 2 drwxr-xr-x 6 terry realaudio 512 Apr 1 1996 pnserver -rw-r--r-- 1 root realaudio 134 Nov 3 10:03 permset.txt barton:/usr/local/realaudio But we can easily ftp a copy over to www. And we'll have a 2.6 gb on the new machine that Matt is working on. We run the ra files off of any of those machines. Access would be good because it will have a lot of disk space."}, {"response": 130, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:24)", "body": "Look at what?"}, {"response": 131, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:25)", "body": "It's in pnserver. barton:/usr/local/realaudio/pnserver ls -rlt total 7 drwxr-xr-x 4 terry realaudio 512 Mar 19 1996 rafiles drwxr-xr-x 5 terry realaudio 512 Apr 11 1996 bin drwxr-xr-x 2 terry realaudio 512 Apr 12 1996 doc -rw-r--r-- 1 terry realaudio 1247 Apr 26 1996 readme.txt -rw-r--r-- 1 terry realaudio 931 Nov 10 03:58 server.cfg drwxr-xr-x 2 terry realaudio 512 Nov 10 03:59 logs barton:/usr/local/realaudio/pnserver"}, {"response": 132, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:26)", "body": "What other questions do we have, Kaff."}, {"response": 133, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:28)", "body": "There are detailed directions at http://www.realaudio.com about how these ra fileservers work."}, {"response": 134, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:29)", "body": "The actual data files are at childrenstory.com Have y'all looked at this?"}, {"response": 135, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:30)", "body": "] Have y'all looked at this? ____ Yes I have peeked around."}, {"response": 136, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:31)", "body": "Just need to do the RA research...Other than that, I'd say we are ready to get started. I've been reading through fairy tales - and I'd forgotten just how offensive some of them can be! Selecting the stories is going to be interesting."}, {"response": 137, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:31)", "body": "Eventually, I'd like to see this site teach kids how to read . There's a buy on the WELL who has offered some web based software for this and he's got years of research into to this with Realaudio and childrens stories on the web. At some point, I'd like to see him come in to the process. Did y'all catch the news about Forrests megadeal? About the Stroud site being acquired?"}, {"response": 138, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:31)", "body": "But! Peeking around time is over. We start in earnest tomorrow. We better let you get to sleep, Terry. You have to be at work tomorrow?"}, {"response": 139, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:32)", "body": "a \"guy\" not a \"buy\" in my above post."}, {"response": 140, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:33)", "body": "I have two days off, I'll be available. Gosh, you're going to have to fly down to Austin at some point!"}, {"response": 141, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:33)", "body": "The project has many redeeming aspects. I would like pointers to RA and reading and kids."}, {"response": 142, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:33)", "body": "And my caf is kicking in."}, {"response": 143, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:34)", "body": "\"Peeking around time is over. We start in earnest tomorrow.\" Agreed. The stories are the priority, and the RA research can be done on my own time."}, {"response": 144, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:36)", "body": "At least y'all have the right permissions and allnow and can be masters of your own destiny, and austen's and the Springs. This project is also paying for the austen domain registration, which I will be sending off next week."}, {"response": 145, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:37)", "body": "Amy have you \"privatized\" this place by allowing only the necessary folks, in other words, did you edit the ulist?"}, {"response": 146, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:38)", "body": "Kaf, I loved your Banderas site!"}, {"response": 147, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:40)", "body": "Thanks, Terry! I just got a note from a journalist today who's going to mention in on TNT's Roughcut! Big time, here I come! [G]"}, {"response": 148, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:40)", "body": "What about doing a site for Texaltel?"}, {"response": 149, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:42)", "body": "No, I have not done the ulist yet, but I will tomorrow. That way the committees can start talking in here. I think it will work better than email. Many of the members are still off on holiday, so we can't resolve on some things but we can begin talking again. I think I may have talked Joan into moderating the divergences of opinion about the austen.com front page."}, {"response": 150, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:43)", "body": "Do you have a domain name for Texatel yet? Anything been created for it?"}, {"response": 151, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:43)", "body": "I am up for that too, Terry, but can we see how the childrenstory thing goes and look at the other one next week? I read the proposal. It looks like that might be a nice little regular income stream for the Spring."}, {"response": 152, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:45)", "body": "I am sorry, guys. I am fading. Talk tomorrow?"}, {"response": 153, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:45)", "body": "They don't want a domain name yet. I need to get just a simple one page prototype up for them. We can just make it up. They don't have any real politicians yet. It would be much easier to knock out quickly for about the same return as childrens story."}, {"response": 154, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:46)", "body": "\"divergences of opinion\" Naw, that couldn't happen! [G] Really, though, this is a tough way to chat. A restricted chat room would be nice. I have a script for a nice one, but it only uses frames, leaving those with older browsers in the dust. (Its kind of like the one you found, Terry)"}, {"response": 155, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:46)", "body": "Sure shall we set up a time?"}, {"response": 156, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:47)", "body": "When does Texatel expect the prototype?"}, {"response": 157, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:48)", "body": "Very, very soon. They want something now."}, {"response": 158, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:49)", "body": "Let me check with Myretta. She is the main one for Yapp and the so called Unix team. Joan still needs some convincing, so we should do the austen.com talk later. Please forgive me. I must away."}, {"response": 159, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:50)", "body": "Okay. Soon. Night."}, {"response": 160, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:50)", "body": "Look at the timetable laid out at http://www.spring.com/~texaltel for an idea. But they want this now. Getting this job has messed me up for carrying through on these jobs. But I'd like to see us evolve as a cohesive unit who can tackle these, and other, jobs to support ourselves and this place."}, {"response": 161, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:51)", "body": "Schedule for our next chat meeting?"}, {"response": 162, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:52)", "body": "How about we meet at noon tomorrow CST. It's 11:43 here now. So in 12 hours?"}, {"response": 163, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:52)", "body": "Terry, I will put full steam on childrenstory over the next two days and try to turn my attention to the other site this weekend if possible. Okay. Now it is really god night. Talk tomorrow for sure, Kaff. Probably to you, too Terry. Sweet dreams."}, {"response": 164, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:53)", "body": "Terry - I think that we could figure out something on the Texatel page. Let me discuss it with Amy. Obviously, tomorrow night won't work to meet - How about we meet here on Wed the 1st at about 12/1pm? We can discuss the progress on the story site and our ideas for the Texatel one."}, {"response": 165, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:57)", "body": "OK. If nothing else, let's touch base briefly every day here at noon and 10 pm ok? Can that be our daily schedule? We don't have to do a marathon every time. Just meet quickly and make sure we're on the right track. And sometimes we can get into depth if we have time. Is that ok?"}, {"response": 166, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:57)", "body": "Good night, y'all. Thanks!"}, {"response": 167, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (23:59)", "body": "Terry - I'll be here at 12/1pm tomorrow, but I'll be out on the town for the evening one. See you tomorrow!"}, {"response": 168, "author": "terry", "date": "Tue, Dec 31, 1996 (00:03)", "body": "See you all at noon. Perhaps Myretta could join us?"}, {"response": 169, "author": "terry", "date": "Tue, Dec 31, 1996 (00:04)", "body": "yeah, I'll probably be out on the town tomorrow night, come to think of it."}, {"response": 170, "author": "terry", "date": "Tue, Dec 31, 1996 (11:09)", "body": "I will not be here at noon as scheduled. Matt wants me to pick up the new server in Austin. So I'm leaving in five minutes. I'll be putting access.spring.com online later today, hopefully, and we'll have another webserver machine with a lot of space on it (2.6 gb). I suggest you proceed on both childrenstory *and* the political website. We need something, even if it's a small step, on both fronts so I can keep these clients happy. And we need a plan of action with some deadlines in place. I'll check back in here when I get back from Austin and read your comments. Go ahead and meet without me."}, {"response": 171, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Tue, Dec 31, 1996 (12:02)", "body": "That works out well, as a friend just stopped by. I'll just give you a brief rundown on what I'm doing. I've chosen a Grimm's Fairy Tale - Snow White and Rose Red (I wanted to do THE LITTLE PRINCE, but haven't found it yet - maybe next time). I'm going to do it in a multi-page format, which will allow for more illustrations, which IMHO are the heart of children's literature. Terry, you may want to check out ArtToday http://www.arttoday.com They have about 550,000 royalty-free images, including a large childrens book area. If I don't see you guys today, I'll check in here tomorrow at 12/1pm. HAPPY NEW YEAR!!!"}, {"response": 172, "author": "terry", "date": "Tue, Dec 31, 1996 (17:25)", "body": "Happy New Year, see you tomorrow at noon CST. access.spring.com is up and running! I'll get you all set with accounts. How is it coming along Amy?"}, {"response": 173, "author": "terry", "date": "Wed, Jan  1, 1997 (16:08)", "body": "I'm around right now. If you ever want me to come up here just give me a \"one ringer\" on my phone 512.303.4000. I'll know that's a signal to get online."}, {"response": 174, "author": "Amy", "date": "Wed, Jan  1, 1997 (21:55)", "body": "\"one ringer\" ___ Great idea. Mine's 812-331-0096. If 331-1896 is busy I am probably online. Back later. I will be up for a while."}, {"response": 175, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Wed, Jan  1, 1997 (22:03)", "body": "Okay! 810-356-0517 and if 356-0317 is busy I'm online."}, {"response": 176, "author": "terry", "date": "Wed, Jan  1, 1997 (22:46)", "body": "I'm here."}, {"response": 177, "author": "terry", "date": "Wed, Jan  1, 1997 (22:48)", "body": "Amy, you just paged me. What's up?"}, {"response": 178, "author": "Amy", "date": "Thu, Jan  2, 1997 (01:33)", "body": "Sorry, Terry. I got called away."}, {"response": 179, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Thu, Jan  2, 1997 (12:04)", "body": "Terry - Thanks for the response to my e-mail. Amy - I asked Terry for the location of childrenstory.com. They are in /var/webdocs or /var/www/webdocs/childrenstory.com"}, {"response": 180, "author": "terry", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (00:03)", "body": "Has anyone given any thought to the politics page. This is increasing in importance."}, {"response": 181, "author": "Amy", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (05:48)", "body": "I can work on it this weekend, Terry."}, {"response": 182, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (11:39)", "body": "Terry - I've been giving Texaltel some thought as well, and my first need is images. I assume that the Texas legislature has some sort of official seal or logo, which we would want on the page. Any thoughts?"}, {"response": 183, "author": "terry", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (22:36)", "body": "Why not do a search for the Texas Legislature. I'll do one now. Texas Legislature Online Next Scheduled Session. Senate: January 14, 1997 - Noon \ufffd\ufffd\ufffd\ufffd\ufffd\ufffd\ufffd\ufffd House: January 14, 1997 - Noon. The Texas Senate.. http://www.capitol.state.tx.us/ - size 5K - 3 Dec 96 Please, excuse the mess as we bring this site up. Stay tuned for new and exciting features, like a discussion forum about the State Platform and links to.. http://www.jcrp.org/stategov.htm - size 3K - 19 Jun 96 Who's running for the Legislature. Voter Info. Political Parties. Whole Texan Ballot. Central Texas candidates in Texas vying for the Texas Senate and the. http://www.austin360.com/news/election/candleg.htm - size 5K - 8 Dec 96 Women Members of the Texas Legislature. 75th Legislature - 1997-1999. House of Representatives. Norma Chavez, El Paso Debra Danburg, Houston Diana Davila,. http://www.lrl.state.tx.us/lrl/women.htm - size 16K - 25 Nov 96 Texas Legislature Online - The Legislative Process in Texas - Introduction THE LEGISLATIVE PROCESS IN TEXAS. BASIC LEGISLATIVE PROCESS. Return of a Bill to the Originating Chamber--Action on Amendments. After a bill has passed... http://www.capitol.state.tx.us/capitol/legproc/retbill.htm - size 2K - 21 Nov 96 You an pull some stuff from here. This is not going to be a public site, it will only be a prototype for Texaltel to look at. Sherry wants something ready by Monday to look at. Read the contract. Let's work together this weekend.. I'll be here solid all weekend."}, {"response": 184, "author": "Amy", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (22:57)", "body": "Terry, Kaff found a seal. I will get the sample page together. Will be out from 2 to 8 pm tomorrow but at the computer the rest of the weekend. We will have something to show for Monday."}, {"response": 185, "author": "terry", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (23:22)", "body": "Great, I'll be here pretty solid this weekend. Let's bounce off each other a lot and give this conference a workout. I hope the Texas Legislative site is useful."}, {"response": 186, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sat, Jan  4, 1997 (12:13)", "body": "Terry - This has nothing to do with anything, but do you have a usenet feed on spring.com? I ask because my ISP's feed seems to miss about 50% of the posts, and its starting to drive me crazy. I thought that maybe I could try yours, if you have one."}, {"response": 187, "author": "terry", "date": "Sat, Jan  4, 1997 (13:14)", "body": "We can get one pretty easily. Prismnet and bastrop.net both have them."}, {"response": 188, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sat, Jan  4, 1997 (16:32)", "body": "No, don't worry about it - you've got enough going on right now. If you already had it - great, if not - no big deal!"}, {"response": 189, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan 13, 1997 (05:21)", "body": "The old-is-new bug just bit me for the first time in weeks. It's probably because I exited this conference prematurely the last time I visited here. deeper conference Main Menu"}]}, {"num": 20, "subject": "Austen.com planning group discussion", "response_count": 2, "posts": [{"response": 1, "author": "terry", "date": "Sat, Jan  4, 1997 (08:10)", "body": "We have a neat little program called 'groupmail' if you want to send mail to a mailing list. Amy, do you have any kind of mailing list of your group at large?"}, {"response": 2, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sat, Jan  4, 1997 (09:48)", "body": "Not really, though Alicia's list is pretty close to our own group's composition. deeper conference Main Menu"}]}, {"num": 21, "subject": "Austen UNIX team discussion", "response_count": 34, "posts": [{"response": 1, "author": "sysop", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (14:00)", "body": "Oops. Somehow the old P&P board logo gif file got set as the wallpaper for the conference index. Well, I thought I'd figured out how to let anyone create a new topic in the austentest conf. But it didn't work. Curious feeling. Now I understand what you were saying, Joan. It lets you go through the process as if you did have the power to create the topic, but it doesn't show up, not even as a topic file in the shell. Hmmm. Back to the manual."}, {"response": 2, "author": "mrobens", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (16:29)", "body": "Oops. Somehow the old P&P board logo gif file got set as the wallpaper for the conference index. Oops, indeed. I must have done it. But how?"}, {"response": 3, "author": "terry", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (22:50)", "body": "I can't see this because I'm shelling it tonight."}, {"response": 4, "author": "Amy", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (23:04)", "body": "Looks like it is back to normal now, Terry. Myretta, did you put it back? Terry how do you allow topic creation in a new conference? Can't make it work with 0 and public in the config file. Also, coudl you mail the cfadm password?"}, {"response": 5, "author": "terry", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (23:24)", "body": "Since you're root, go ahead and set it to what you like and let me know what it is."}, {"response": 6, "author": "mrobens", "date": "Sat, Jan  4, 1997 (11:55)", "body": "Looks like it is back to normal now, Terry. Myretta, did you put it back? I restored the former rc file."}, {"response": 7, "author": "Amy", "date": "Thu, Jan  9, 1997 (08:55)", "body": "Put on the list for sometime down the road. A would-be-nice thing really: From chat From: Amy at 1/9/97 9:38 AM The www.spring.com machine is not set up right for mail. We need to do something to let you invoke pine. Bernie: Yes please. At least I'm vaguely familiar with Pine. I finally manager to get into Spring. At least I'm not the only one who has problems with a shell account."}, {"response": 8, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Fri, Jan 10, 1997 (02:56)", "body": "Amy : We need to do something to let you invoke pine. Huh? I am using pine. (Though I hate it!) You just type pine (lower case) at the $ prompt, or !pine from within bbs. Or do you mean from the web interface? I thought that mail only worked if you had a shell account. (I do not think there is a POP3 mail server here. If so, people could use Netscape mail or Eudora or whatever.)"}, {"response": 9, "author": "Amy", "date": "Fri, Jan 10, 1997 (04:18)", "body": "] I am using pine. ----- It is a terminal emulation thing. I use either the telnet program that comes with windows or Smartcom. - Can invoke Pine in Smartcom when telnetting to www.spring.com. - Can invoke Pine in my telnet window when telnetting to bluemarble.net, othello.indiana.edu, even access.spring.com and barton.spring.com -- but not www.spring.com"}, {"response": 10, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Fri, Jan 10, 1997 (04:26)", "body": "It is a terminal emulation thing. Does your software not permit choice of Terminal emulation? It can be set locally in the .profile (or is it .login?) file..."}, {"response": 11, "author": "churchh", "date": "Fri, Jan 10, 1997 (05:03)", "body": "Joan, it's all VT100, but some Telnet programs are better than others, and able to adapt to small variations in the host's idea of what a VT100 is. Apparently the default Telnet program that comes with Windows 95 is not a very heavy duty or industrial strength one..."}, {"response": 12, "author": "Amy", "date": "Fri, Jan 10, 1997 (06:19)", "body": "But Bernie works on a Mac and can't run it either. Also the fact that the other Spring machines will let me run pine in the same crumby ap leades me to believe there must be some way to configure the thing from within Spring."}, {"response": 13, "author": "terry", "date": "Fri, Jan 10, 1997 (07:17)", "body": "If you want a good terminal program get crt or one of the other ones Stroud reviews on his site and that we discuss in the apps conference."}, {"response": 14, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Fri, Jan 10, 1997 (20:30)", "body": "\"If you want a good terminal program' This is not the issue - the issue is that people ought to be able to use what they have as long as it supports VT100. They should not have to go out and get different software every time they visit a different server. There must be a way to configure things so that Pine will work on all servers."}, {"response": 15, "author": "churchh", "date": "Sat, Jan 11, 1997 (00:11)", "body": "Lousy VT100 emulation from either or both the host side and the microcomputer side is an issue..."}, {"response": 16, "author": "terry", "date": "Sat, Jan 11, 1997 (12:24)", "body": "I've had pretty good success using crt. What specific probelms with VT100 emulation need fixing. Do we need to issue new .profile and .cshrc files Henry?"}, {"response": 17, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Jan 26, 1997 (07:56)", "body": "Myretta, Terry, anybody: Has anybody learned much about the www user set-up? We have two users: Carl Goss and Janet Aylmer, who can't seem to get in no matter what they try. I was going to wipe out their previous attempts to register in hopes that a clean slate might make things... I don't know... cleaner. But I don't have a good understanding of how the thing works. If I could find the script it might tell me more, provided it is in perl and not the Yapp command language."}, {"response": 18, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Jan 26, 1997 (08:02)", "body": "Oh, and speaking of perl, this is not the right topic for it, but when I was trying to make that email form script work Thursday night, I could not discover where the cgi-bin is. I notice Yapp CGI scripts need an alias directory so they can be found by the seb server. Terry, is it possible there are no other CGI scripts here besides the ones used by Yapp. If so, do you you have any philosophical, practical or any other kinds of worries about allowing cgi in any directory on the system? There are pros and cons."}, {"response": 19, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Jan 26, 1997 (08:33)", "body": "re Janet Aylmer's login info It may be a browser/cookie problem. I have messed up my own cookies by trying to log in as Janet, inadvertently leaving the \"Save password\" box checked in the form that pops up from my system."}, {"response": 20, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Jan 26, 1997 (08:58)", "body": "I wiped out Janet's various www accounts so she can start fresh. I think I should advise her to dump the old password files on her system, too. But I can't even see where MSIE or windows keeps mine. There is a \"cookies\" subdir under the windows dir in Win95, but I don't see Spring or Yapp password files in there. Anybody know where these files are kept in windows, mac, MSIE, netscape?"}, {"response": 21, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan 26, 1997 (09:28)", "body": "Amy, go in and set up unix shell accounts for these folks with 'adduser' and then run Dave's webuser program to synch them up on the web. And let them know that they have shell access."}, {"response": 22, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Jan 26, 1997 (09:35)", "body": "Where is the webuser program?"}, {"response": 23, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan 26, 1997 (16:40)", "body": "It should be in /usr/bbs/bin I believe."}, {"response": 24, "author": "mrobens", "date": "Sun, Jan 26, 1997 (20:26)", "body": "The webuser executable is in /usr/local/bin. Would you like me to do this, Amy? You know how I am."}, {"response": 25, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Jan 26, 1997 (21:08)", "body": "I already emailed Janet after wiping out her accounts. I don't know that she and Carl want or need shell accounts. What is everyone's feeling about this?"}, {"response": 26, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Sun, Jan 26, 1997 (22:43)", "body": "Once your account has been webified, you can no longer come in except through the shell?"}, {"response": 27, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan 26, 1997 (23:59)", "body": "Sure you can, you can come into the shell or in to the web with the same username and password on both. I do this every day without any problems and very few \"old as new incidents\"."}, {"response": 28, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan 27, 1997 (00:01)", "body": "Joan, do you have an index.html file in your public_html directory?"}, {"response": 29, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Mon, Jan 27, 1997 (02:11)", "body": "If Janet A. et al can still come in via their web browsers, then I can't see that it would matter to them whether or not their account were technically a shell account. They would not need to deal with that unless they chose to, right? Terry: Joan, do you have an index.html file in your public_html directory? Not yet, but I have been thinking of making one - I have to do a presentation at a conference on technology for the disabled on \"Demystifying the WWW\" and I thought that I might try to construct some stuff for that."}, {"response": 30, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan 27, 1997 (07:42)", "body": "That would be of a lot of interest around Austin to some of our sight impaired users like Buddy, Hugo, George, and Gary who have been asking me about ways to get on the web. I'll pass on your findings to them. I ran into an interesting program over the weekend called 'DragonDictate' which will take dictation at 110 wpm and includes a screen reader. And these guys have mentioned a program to me called Telesensory that they say is the most popular Windows 95 screen reader among sight disabled folks."}, {"response": 31, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Mon, Jan 27, 1997 (20:39)", "body": "Getting VH people access to graphical interfaces is a whole other issue - and not what I will be dealing with in my presentation - mine will be more of what it is and how it works and what all those wierd terms mean. At the conference, though, every major vendor of such stuff as Dragon Dictate and Telesensory and Power Secretary and multitudes of other hardware and software tools to give access to people with all kinds of disabilites will be there demonstrating their products and giving presentati ns on them. there are 2 major conferences with like this each year - \"Closing the Gap\" which is in Minneapolis in November and the CSUN conference in Los Angeles in March. - at which just about everyopne who is a vendor makes an appearance - and if they don't, talk is that they are going under, and they ususually do."}, {"response": 32, "author": "terry", "date": "Tue, Jan 28, 1997 (06:48)", "body": "What are some good websites on this topic? Are there ways to make our websitefriendlier to sight disabled folks?"}, {"response": 33, "author": "churchh", "date": "Tue, Jan 28, 1997 (11:11)", "body": "Terry, I have something partly on this topic at http://uts.cc.utexas.edu/~churchh/htnimglt.html Spring already conforms to most of the guidelines there..."}, {"response": 34, "author": "terry", "date": "Tue, Jan 28, 1997 (22:05)", "body": "You may have already seen this in the yapp conference, but it is worth repeating in deeper: Topic 44 of 45: 'Austen conference at Spring' Response 3 of 4: Henry (churchyh@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu) Tue, Jan 28, 1997 (11:39) 5 lines A lot of the e-mail addresses for web users at our site are bogus, because the default choice that's presented to them is the concatenation of: The user name they're choosing to be known as here + \"@\" + the result of running reverse DNS lookup on the IP address they're coming in from There probably isn't any better way to construct such a default, but unfortunately an e-mail address constructed according to this procedure will be bogus in many cases, and a lot of people don't bother to edit the default... So the result is that there's a lot of bogus pseudo-addresses of the general type \" MickJagger@dial-in-ppp42-9.custmax.ms.uu.net \", or whatever... Topic 44 of 45: 'Austen conference at Spring' Response 4 of 4: Dave Thaler (thaler@armidale.ann-arbor.mi.us) Tue, Jan 28, 1997 (19:20) 18 lines This is the purpose of the \"Participants\" button which should be at the top of the page of the list of topics in the conference. By default, this shows the login, last time on, and full name (but not email address) of the participant. A host can change this by putting a command in the conference rc file which redefines the \"partmsg\" variable to look like anything you want. For example, def partmsg '%10v %o %20u %{email}' will show the login, last time on, full name, and email address. If you just want a list of email addresses of conference members yourself, you could generate this in Unix and save it to a file from in Yapp with: def partmsg '%{email}' participants > filename -Dave deeper conference Main Menu"}]}, {"num": 22, "subject": "Austen Conference Administration", "response_count": 5, "posts": [{"response": 1, "author": "terry", "date": "Sat, Jan 25, 1997 (18:44)", "body": "Amy, what are your thoughts on getting A&E to sponsor a banner ad her to fund expansion of the austen site and/or getting them to list the url in some of their programming and on their website. I'm referring to www.austen.com. By the way, I may move the domain to the same server we're running all the other websites on."}, {"response": 2, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sat, Jan 25, 1997 (18:49)", "body": "Fill us in on the latest about austen.com and the purpose for the other servers, Terry. I am confused. Ads would be placed by a different department than the people I know, but if everything goes as I hope and I get some project work from A&E, I may be able to plant the link myself. Let's not talk about this outside deeper. I don't want to jinx my chances."}, {"response": 3, "author": "terry", "date": "Sat, Jan 25, 1997 (18:56)", "body": "OK. Had I known of this relationship of yours I wouldn't have mentioned it. Feel free to go into root and re-edit my and your comments to say something else if you like."}, {"response": 4, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Jan 26, 1997 (07:45)", "body": "Amy] Let's not talk about this outside deeper. I don't want to jinx my chances. Terry] OK. Had I known of this relationship of yours I wouldn't have mentioned it. Feel free to go into root and re-edit my and your comments to say something else if you like. __ No, no. I don't feel the need to go that far. It is just that I am in the middle of negotiating a rate for doing an Ivanhoe discussion page right now, meaning the little deal should be locked by Monday. So I could have been embarrassed had someone approached the same people about advertising here. I'll let you know what transpires."}, {"response": 5, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan 26, 1997 (09:29)", "body": "Sure, let us know. I'll keep mum about this. deeper conference Main Menu"}]}, {"num": 23, "subject": "Conferencing Software Options", "response_count": 12, "posts": [{"response": 1, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Mon, Jan 13, 1997 (01:26)", "body": "Tonight I received the following from a friend who makes his living doing computer conferencing. He said: ] Hi Joan, good to hear from you! ] ] I spend most of my time on two Motet conferencing systems: ] ] Cafe Utne http://www.utne.com/cafe ] ] NCO Web Cafe http://nco.northfield.mn.us ] ] I run Cafe Utne and am on the steering committee for NCO. Motet ] was built for the web and works fine with text-based Lynx but no ] menu/command text modes. ] ] The best resource for all web-based conferencing systems is David ] Woolley. See his home page at: ] ] http://freenet.msp.mn.us/people/drwool/ ] ] The freenet server seems to be down tonight, but check on Monday."}, {"response": 2, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Mon, Jan 13, 1997 (01:27)", "body": "I looked quickly at the entry pages for the Motet systems, but did not yet register: http://www.utne.com/cafe About Caf\ufffd Utne: We use Motet, a state-of-the-art software platform designed from the ground up for Web conferencing. By \"conferencing\" we mean group discussion forums, similar to Usenet Newsgroups. Motet uses a structure that's more conducive to group conversation. It has features that make it easier to manage multiple discussions on multiple topics, including the ability to filter out topics and people! It's far different than an Internet mailing list or USENET Newsgroup. Caf\ufffd Utne is free. All that's required is that you complete a registration form. You must have a forms-capable Web browser in order to use Motet. We do NOT currently have real-time chat capabilities."}, {"response": 3, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Mon, Jan 13, 1997 (01:28)", "body": "http://nco.northfield.mn.us Enter the Cafe here if you're already registered. Register here to receive your user ID and password. We want the NCO Web Cafe to be a safe, friendly place to discuss issues and concerns of particular relevance to Northfielders. We encourage dialog and debate, and know that it will sometimes become heated. Please use your best judgement in dealing with others online. If you'd like more specific guidelines, check out our Netiquette guide. We use Motet, a state-of-the-art software platform designed from the ground up for Web conferencing. By \"conferencing\" we mean group discussion forums, similar to Usenet Newsgroups. Motet uses a structure that's more conducive to group conversation. The Cafe is open all day and all night, but it's not a real-time chat facility. People visit at their convenience, read the conversations of interest to them since they last visited, and add messages of their own as they move from conference room to conference room, topic to topic. Here's a more detailed way to view the Cafe, using the metaphor of a real Cafe. Cafe Entrance You use your key to open the door to the Cafe and walk in (by signing on with UserID and password). The Main Page You walk into a big room at the center of the Cafe called the Main Page. Here's where you get a cup of coffee and get your bearings every time you visit. It's an area you can return to anytime while you roam the many discussion rooms (\"conferences\"). The Main Page is where you can: - Check the Conference Directory (list of all conferences) - Check/edit your Conference Hotlist (conferences you want to read) - Visit the Motet Help area - Edit your online biography - Edit your bozo list (people whose postings you choose not to see) - Change your password - Find other users - Go to a specific conference by typing in a name - Go to your first conference with new postings Conference Directory If you check the Conference Directory by clicking the \"List all Conferences\" button, you'll notice that the Cafe has many different discussion rooms (\"conferences\"), each with a name and description on the door to indicate the broad subject area. Enter a Conference You pick a conference room with a name that interests you and walk in. Each conference has its own central area called the Conference Home Page. A conference can have an unlimited number of topics. (A topic is like a wall with a bulletin board on it, with a one-line description at the top.) For example, the BridgeSquare conference had these topics on July 19: Topic #1. Sign in Topic #2. What's up with you today? This week? Topic #3. Summer, 1996 - Community/civic happenings Topic #4. Defeat of Jesse James Days - pros and cons Topic #5. Suggestions for new conferences in the Cafe Topic #6. Movies Each of these bulletin boards (conference topics) can hold an unlimited number of yellow post-it notes (postings)--messages placed by you and other Cafe visitors in chronological order. The Cafe can have any number of conferences and any number of topics: Conference A Topic #1. Posting #1, Posting #2, Posting #3, #4, #5, etc. Topic #2. Posting #1, Posting #2, Posting #3, #4, #5, etc. Topic #3. Posting #1, Posting #2, Posting #3, #4, #5, etc. Etc. Conference B Topic #1. Posting #1, Posting #2, Posting #3, #4, #5, etc. Topic #2. Posting #1, Posting #2, Posting #3, #4, #5, etc. Topic #3. Posting #1, Posting #2, Posting #3, #4, #5, etc. Etc. Conference C Conference D Conference E Conference F Etc. Postings Everyone's messages (\"postings\") are automatically stamped with the name and UserID of the author, the date and time of posting, and the number of lines of the posting. Usually you compose your posting to a topic while you are in the conference, typing online in the textbox. However, you can also compose it with your favorite word processor, then copy and paste it into the textbox. So, get in there and join the discussion! The Web Cafe is free. All that's required is that you complete a registration form. You must have a forms-capable Web browser in order to use Motet. We do not currently have real-time chat capabilities."}, {"response": 4, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan 13, 1997 (02:17)", "body": "Motet is a good solution. I wonder what the current cost is for Motet?"}, {"response": 5, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan 13, 1997 (05:26)", "body": "Perhaps we could set it up on access.spring.com if it is within our budget."}, {"response": 6, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Mon, Jan 13, 1997 (13:50)", "body": "] Motet is a good solution. Maybe - but let's check things out a bit before leaping into anything - one \"strike\" that it has against it is that it requires a frames-capable browser. This will leave people out. At this point I don't know what, if anything, it does about threading or linking - does anyone else? I would guess that it is probably not super-costly, or Northfield Community Online would not be able to afford it. (Unless they give price breaks to govt., education, non-profits, etc.) There may be other worthwhile options on David Woolley's page, too - but the msp freenet server still appears to be down."}, {"response": 7, "author": "churchh", "date": "Mon, Jan 13, 1997 (13:56)", "body": ""}, {"response": 8, "author": "churchh", "date": "Mon, Jan 13, 1997 (13:56)", "body": ""}, {"response": 9, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Mon, Jan 13, 1997 (17:17)", "body": "My error! Forms, not frames! More from Griff... ] Nope, frames are not required. Only browsers that can handle FORMS. ] ]]] The freenet server seems to be down tonight, but check on Monday. ]] ]] Thanks - I will - do they have links to places where the systems can ]] be experienced in action? ] ] Yes. Their server may not be back up till Tues or Wed I'm told. ] ]]I meant to ask whether Motet permits attaching (or linking) of responses ]] to specific postings left by others or whether it is Caucus-like in that ]] you can only add a response to the end of the line. ] ] The posts get put at the end of the line like Caucus. But you can ] hotlink to posting 67 in the same topic, [post:politics.5.45-89] would ] be a link to posts 45-89, topic 5 of the Politics conf, etc."}, {"response": 10, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Mon, Jan 13, 1997 (17:19)", "body": "Dang! Last paragraph got clobbered - had pointy brackets in the text: ] The posts get put at the end of the line like Caucus. But you can ] embed a link in the post to a previous post, or any posts/series of ] posts/topics in the entire conferecing system, eg [post:67] would be a ] hotlink to posting 67 in the same topic, [post:politics.5.45-89] would ] be a link to posts 45-89, topic 5 of the Politics conf, etc."}, {"response": 11, "author": "jwinsor", "date": "Mon, Jan 27, 1997 (20:52)", "body": "Last night I went over to the Northfield (MN) Cafe - which runs on Motet, and ran through the tutorial and the other help files, and I thought that I sent folks both the main Motet info page, and a follow up regarding something I found in the Northfield tutorial - but I can not find this in my sent mail folder, so I am not sure whether it went or not. The thing that I found (and quoted) was a section that said that though links were possible, html was not - and they gave a bunch of rationale about why not. After sleeping on it, though, I am wondering whether html might be an option in Moted that the Northfield people opted not to implement. Am going to try to find out about this - the interface (in the demo) was very nice and had some neat options - such as being able to \"hide\" a response that is very long, for example, so that people who were not interested did not have to wait for it to transfer, but they can elect to see it if they choose to. The main Motet page (by the publisher) is at: http://www.sonic.net/~foggy/motet/ And another option called \"Focus\" that advertises itself as being threaded is at: http://www.ukweb.com/focus/focus.html"}, {"response": 12, "author": "terry", "date": "Tue, Jan 28, 1997 (06:50)", "body": "Joan, you're welcome to install an evaluation copy of Motet on access.spring.com This machine is our testing ground for new software and a aplace to run disk intensive applications that are too big for barton.spring.com or www.spring.com. deeper conference Main Menu"}]}, {"num": 24, "subject": "The spring's main page guest editor", "response_count": 10, "posts": [{"response": 1, "author": "terry", "date": "Wed, Jan 22, 1997 (23:40)", "body": "Would anyone like to volunteer to be guest editor this coming week on the Spring's main page? I'd like to see something about childrenstory, Jane Austen and the apps conference... but these are just suggestions. The Spring front page needs a fresh perspective. Something worthy of all the wonderful connotations the name brings up."}, {"response": 2, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Thu, Jan 23, 1997 (17:52)", "body": "How about a logo something like this (on a white background)?"}, {"response": 3, "author": "terry", "date": "Thu, Jan 23, 1997 (19:43)", "body": "I like it. What do you think of the water background that we have? Kaf' would you like to guest edit for a week? I'm pretty sure you have access to /var/www/docs where the Spring page resides. Be my guest if you'd like."}, {"response": 4, "author": "Amy", "date": "Thu, Jan 23, 1997 (20:23)", "body": "I like the green, Kaf."}, {"response": 5, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Thu, Jan 23, 1997 (22:24)", "body": "I'll take a stab at it Terry. I like the water background - but in general, I think that backgrounds look better on personal home pages than on professional sites. Would you mind if I tried it without one? I intentionally used the P&P green, so that there would be continuity between the main site page and the (eventual) P&P page. :)"}, {"response": 6, "author": "terry", "date": "Thu, Jan 23, 1997 (23:44)", "body": "You have total artistic freedom, kaf. I love the pages I've seen of yours, especially Banderas and Childrens Story. The only little tweak childrens story needs is getting realaudio links on the stories themselves. Would you say it's ready for primetime? Childrens Story as the lead on the Spring main page? How about a discussion group on Banderas and a link to your site? How about mirroring the Banderas site here on a dedicated address? I bet you could think up a cool name we could register. (unless, of course, you're bound to have Banderas exclusively where it is). Let your imagaination run wild."}, {"response": 7, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Fri, Jan 24, 1997 (16:55)", "body": "Actually, Terry, I've been giving some thought to your questions about how to attract new conferences. It seems to me that the fan sites are always starting mailing lists or bulletin boards - but many people who start fan sites don't have access to a cgi-bin or mailing list software - they could generate a lot of traffic here. I'd like to add a section of the spring homepage to welcoming fan sites to the spring. I don't think that I'd want to mirror the entire Banderas site here, but I might consider moving my Bulletin board over - it would generate traffic second only to the P&P conference. My only hesitation is that many people might not like the yapp interface initially (as happened with P&P) - I don't want to alienate people for no good reason. (BTW, I should mention that I was one of the people who didn't like the yapp interface at first, but now prefer it - but not everyone has come around.) I think maybe what we should do is create a Banderas conference here, I'll set up some topics, and then I'll invite everyone over here to try it out. Then let the majority rule - if they want to stay with Matt's script, or move over to the spring. Oh, and Re:RealAudio files. Susan hasn't been available this week to record hers, but we have a firm appointment on Sunday to get it done - so I should have those links ready by Sunday night."}, {"response": 8, "author": "terry", "date": "Fri, Jan 24, 1997 (21:48)", "body": "That's a great idea to move the Banderas discussion here. I think if we get enough fan groups here there could be an interesting intermingling. Please go ahead with this. What are some other fan groups that you would like to see here?"}, {"response": 9, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sat, Jan 25, 1997 (11:06)", "body": "Terry - The page of the week is now up and running."}, {"response": 10, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan 26, 1997 (09:31)", "body": "I made a few minor additions to keep the users pages alive and put links on the conference references. Wow, it looks good and tells our story. Nice! deeper conference Main Menu"}]}, {"num": 25, "subject": "Growing the Spring - adding new groups", "response_count": 2, "posts": [{"response": 1, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan 26, 1997 (09:35)", "body": "What groups would you like to see move here? We've talked about Banderas. Is this possible? How do we reach folks who could use a forum like we hve here? Do we need to submit to more search engines? Do we need our own web robot?"}, {"response": 2, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan 26, 1997 (09:50)", "body": "What about pumping up the travel conference. Finding more groups like the Curacao discussion? How do we get in touch with natural groups who would form a discussion area similar to the Austen phenomenon? deeper conference Main Menu"}]}, {"num": 26, "subject": "home pages for conferencees", "response_count": 3, "posts": [{"response": 1, "author": "mrobens", "date": "Mon, Jan 27, 1997 (10:30)", "body": "Terry, You're getting pretty low on disk space on spring.com. Do you have another server in mind for this?"}, {"response": 2, "author": "churchh", "date": "Mon, Jan 27, 1997 (11:32)", "body": "Terry, a lot of the e-mail addresses for web users are bogus, becuas the default choice that's presented to them is the concatenation of: The user name they're choosing for spring + \"@\" + the result of running reverse DNS lookup on the IP address they're coming in from There probably isn't any better way to construct such a default, but unfortunately an e-mail address constructed according to this procedure will be bogus in mnay cases, and a lot of people don't bother to edit the default... So the result is that there's a lot of bogus pseudo-addresses of the general type \" ColFitzwilliam@dial-in-ppp42-9.custmax.ms.uu.net \", or whatever..."}, {"response": 3, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan 27, 1997 (20:08)", "body": "We need an email verification program to validate new users before they're accepted. We should be emailing them passwords and their accounts should become active till they log in with their password that has been emailed to them. And we need to have a questionaire that is user definable that new users have to fill in. The results of the questionaire would be kept in a tab delimited file which could easily be converted to a database. Without a tool like this, we will never get a grip on our user community and it will remain basically an anonymous group. I hope that this can be incorporated into the next build. The new account questionaire should run on both the unix shell and on the web. This is our single most vital need. deeper conference Main Menu"}]}, {"num": 27, "subject": "TransSoft Mail Control", "response_count": 2, "posts": [{"response": 1, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sat, Feb  8, 1997 (17:11)", "body": "Terry, do you mirror Bjorn's site as a special favor? Or is this something you often do in connection with the Stroud site? Actually, I have never quite understood your relationship with the Stroud reviews."}, {"response": 2, "author": "terry", "date": "Sat, Feb  8, 1997 (21:46)", "body": "Basically, I hooked up Forrest with a new source on income and he benefited from that and he sends traffic to the Spring off of every review he writes with a link. Now Forrest has a mega deal with Mecklermedia and Iworld ... they bought him out. deeper conference Main Menu"}]}, {"num": 28, "subject": "spring water company sponsorhip possibilities", "response_count": 0, "posts": []}, {"num": 29, "subject": "web tv and tvpc", "response_count": 2, "posts": [{"response": 1, "author": "terry", "date": "Tue, Feb 11, 1997 (21:58)", "body": "Some comments gleaned from the WELL: Topic 677 [internet]: The Future of the Information Highway #897 of 907: John Pescatore (jpesca) Tue Feb 11 '97 (04:30) 67 lines NEW YORK--(BUSINESS WIRE) Costs vs. features prove primary concern in purchase decision A new survey released today by Cyber Dialogue, the premiere online research and database marketing company, shows that 51 percent of cybercitizens would purchase WebTV, a service that delivers the Internet via television, in addition to a PC for use in their home. While respondents indicated they are interested in purchasing WebTV, most aren't willing to pay for the costs of this capability. When asked how much they would be willing to pay for a WebTV terminal hook-up in their home and one year of unlimited access (the hook-up/set-top box currently costs about $330.00 plus $20 per month for access fees): 21 percent said less than $50; 18 percent said $50 - $99; and 24 percent said $100 - $199. The survey also examined what types of features and services respondents expect from WebTV. Respondents rated the following features they feel are absolutely essential: ease of access (85 percent); ability to send e-mail (85 percent); \"TV quality\" video over ordinary high speed modems (82 percent); graphic and sound quality (79 percent); and Telephony - able to make long-distance calls through the Internet (71 percent). \"People aren't looking for the 'bells and whistles' yet,\" said Kevin Mabley, Cyber Dialogue's Director of Research. \"They want the basics -- affordable surfing with unlimited access. It's all about communication convenience.\" Parental regulation is also a factor in purchasing WebTV. Sixty-four percent of respondents said it is absolutely essential for WebTV to offer options that allow parents to protect or regulate areas which might be inappropriate for children. What will the future hold in terms of new WebTV capabilities? Respondents expect the following features to become a reality: interactive capabilities (78 percent); videoconferencing (78 percent); free set-top box with service subscriptions (77 percent); built in ports to handle devices such as printers and cable modems (75 percent); the ability to log on from other people's WebTV terminals (68 percent); and ability to pay bills online (67 percent). The survey also uncovered major obstacles that may keep consumers from buying the product in the near future. The top five deterrents include: monthly service fees in addition to cable and current e-mail accounts (85 percent); expense of actual product (70 percent); limited choices in selection of WebTV provider/not able to change (66 percent); providers - not enough out there yet (61 percent); and tying up your TV for other household members (59 percent). This survey, of 644 cybercitizens, was conducted online for Cyber Dialogue's January 1997 Omnibus and has a margin of error +/- 5 points. As part of a collaborative effort between Cyber Dialogue and Business Wire, online polls dealing with the Internet, consumer issues and news of the day are made available to Business Wire subscribers. Headquartered in New York City, Cyber Dialogue ( http://www.cyberdialogue.com)conducts market research online via the World Wide Web (WWW) and through an agreement with America Online (AOL). The company offers a wide range of market research solutions, including online focus groups, e-mail polls and consumer panels. The company also develops and sells database mining and decision support software for online and interactive marketing. Cyber Dialogue is the sister company to Yankelovich Partners, the nation's preeminent provider of strategic custom research. Topic 677 [internet]: The Future of the Information Highway #898 of 907: Tony Barreca (tbarreca) Tue Feb 11 '97 (07:36) 9 lines John, thanks for posting the article on the CyberDialogue survey that showed cost vs. features was a primary determinant in WebTV purchase. It was very informative, but we don't want to violate the \"fair use\" provisions of copyright law. I believe that the accepted WELL practice when someone posts an entire article is to hide it. Therefore, I am going to do so. If you want to see the article, type \"o 897\" at the \"Respond\" prompt (in picospan, at least, but I bet there's an equivalent for users of other interfaces, and I bet someone will be nice to say what it is. Thanks.) Topic 677 [internet]: The Future of the Information Highway #899 of 907: Laura Lemay (mtrbike) Tue Feb 11 '97 (07:55) 6 lines BTW the box cost is now $289, with the keyboard down to $50. As I joked to the sales guy, \"If I stand here for another ten minutes or so, will it come down again?\" Topic 677 [internet]: The Future of the Information Highway #900 of 907: Robert Lauriston (duck) Tue Feb 11 '97 (09:12) 11 lines \"The top five deterrents include: monthly service fees in addition to cable and current e-mail accounts (85 percent) ...\" A WebTV box would be a lot more appealing if you could use it with any ISP you wanted. "}, {"response": 2, "author": "sprin5", "date": "Tue, Apr 25, 2000 (08:28)", "body": "Wow, back to 1997. This conference has been forgotten so long! deeper conference Main Menu"}]}, {"num": 3, "subject": "www.childrenstory.com", "response_count": 85, "posts": [{"response": 1, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (00:35)", "body": "I just created two realaudio files and stuck them in the /var/www/webdocs/childrenstor vy.com directory on www.spring.com"}, {"response": 2, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (00:38)", "body": "The files in /var/www/webdocs/childrenstory.com are: cinderella.ra and princess.ra I'm missing about a minute of the beginning of princess that I'll have to get Jonathon's friend to re-record."}, {"response": 3, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (01:12)", "body": "The ra file I called cinderella should be renamed sleepbeaut.ra It's Sleeping Beauty. Amy, see if you can add a link to it."}, {"response": 4, "author": "terry", "date": "Tue, Dec 31, 1996 (11:00)", "body": "Do we need a beta tester? Topic 43 of 113: 'New P&P2 Scenes' Response 43 of 43: AnneMarie (moonshine) Tue, Dec 31, 1996 (10:48) 7 lines (I am only 9 years old, so my mother is helping me here with spelling, etc.) ...continuing above ball scene..."}, {"response": 5, "author": "Amy", "date": "Thu, Jan  2, 1997 (20:21)", "body": "Kaff, when I was driving home from my meeting tonight I was thinking about how lovely your story looks and had three thoughts related to that: 1. How will I ever make something as pretty? Maybe we should divide up our duties differently 2. It is so, pretty people will want to print it out 3. If it is printed out, maybe we should have the URL on at least the first or last page so people can get back to childrenstory.com (but the trade off is making the page not pretty by including such a pedestrian thing -- or maybe there is a pretty way of doing it) Amy"}, {"response": 6, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Thu, Jan  2, 1997 (20:38)", "body": "Thanks, Amy. :) I've tried to reply to your previous e-mail several times today, but it keeps getting bounced back (saying that bluemarble.net doesn't exist). I'll try again now. As to the URL on the pages - I only use Netscape, but when I print something for the web it automatically prints the URL at the top of each page. I wonder if Explorer does that as well? I'll have to check."}, {"response": 7, "author": "Amy", "date": "Thu, Jan  2, 1997 (20:43)", "body": "] automatically prints the URL at the top of each page. I wonder if Explorer does that as well? I'll have to check. __ No. MSIE only return the html document [title]"}, {"response": 8, "author": "terry", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (00:04)", "body": "Amy has mail here at the Spring if she needs a backup. It can even be set up to hold and forward mail at the same time so she could get it both places."}, {"response": 9, "author": "Amy", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (05:49)", "body": "] mail here at the Spring if she needs a backup __ Thanks Terry. I do not normally have problems. Bloomington is a college town like Austin. Maintenance tends to go on during university holidays. That's probably all it is."}, {"response": 10, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (14:44)", "body": "Terry - I have finished one story and begun to renovate the homepage for the site. Given the amount being billed for this, I cannot really devote any more time to the homepage on this billing. Please take a look at http://www.spring.com/~kaffeine/index.html If they meet with your approval, I will move them over to childrenstory.com (or let me know if you would rather keep the existing homepage, and I will just move the story over there)."}, {"response": 11, "author": "terry", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (22:39)", "body": "The page looks good. What do you think Amy? What it needs the most is a link to the Realaudio files."}, {"response": 12, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (22:47)", "body": "A link to the existing RA files that you created? Have you fixed the one that had some stuff missing?"}, {"response": 13, "author": "terry", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (22:55)", "body": "Not yet, but go ahead and put a reference to it as this is only a test site at this stage."}, {"response": 14, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (23:28)", "body": "Terry - I just added a test link to princess.ra, but it doesn't look like the MIME types are set up - the browser tried to load it as text."}, {"response": 15, "author": "terry", "date": "Sat, Jan  4, 1997 (07:53)", "body": "OK. I haven't set up mime types before, I'll see what this requires."}, {"response": 16, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sun, Jan  5, 1997 (19:05)", "body": "Terry - I'm sending you an invoice via e-mail. Let me know if you don't receive it."}, {"response": 17, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan  6, 1997 (22:38)", "body": "Please ask around and try and find somone who can help us get realaudio working? Jonahton really wants to see this happen. I talked to him today and gave him a bill for the html work. I hope to get paid tomorrow but he's coming on pretty strong about the realaudio working. I added a mime types entry to the web server mime types file. This is really, really important to figure out and I have to work tomorrow. I can only get on the Internet about 15 minutes a day at work, but I do have my email forwarded there. Perhaps we should ask around in the conference and maybe in asome newsgroups. Matt could do it but he's too busy."}, {"response": 18, "author": "Amy", "date": "Tue, Jan  7, 1997 (06:24)", "body": "Terry, if you can't find someone who knows what she is doing, I can try to figure out the RealAudio server, but not until Thursday or Friday. Don't push me to do it earlier. I have a deadline for my only regular gig that I can't afford to blow. It will take me probably 9 times as long to work out as somebody who knows something, but maybe I can get a little help here and there. P.S. & BTW, your mail is bouncing again."}, {"response": 19, "author": "terry", "date": "Tue, Jan  7, 1997 (10:27)", "body": "From: Chris Spurgeon To: terry@spring.com Subject: RealAudio help Saw your post in the web conference about needing realAudio help. I'll be happy to take a look, if you'd like. I installed Real Audio on my BSDI system (at http://whyy.org) . Feel free to e-mail me or give me a call at 215-351-3315 (that's in Philadelphia). I'll be in the office starting this afternoon at about 1PM, Eastern time, but you can leave a message. Ignore this message if you've already solved the problem! Chris Spurgeon Kathleen and the unix group can you please co-ordinate this with Amy. I'm out of pocket at work today. See if we can get Chris involved ok? mailto://ces@well.com"}, {"response": 20, "author": "terry", "date": "Thu, Jan  9, 1997 (23:08)", "body": "Here's where our present realaudio server files reside: barton# cd usr/local barton# ls bin etc lib man realaudio barton# cd realaudio barton# ls permset.txt pnserver barton# ls -rlt total 2 drwxr-xr-x 6 terry realaudio 512 Apr 1 1996 pnserver -rw-r--r-- 1 root realaudio 134 Nov 3 10:03 permset.txt barton# cd prnserver prnserver: No such file or directory. barton# cd pnserver barton# ls -rlt total 7 drwxr-xr-x 4 terry realaudio 512 Mar 19 1996 rafiles drwxr-xr-x 5 terry realaudio 512 Apr 11 1996 bin drwxr-xr-x 2 terry realaudio 512 Apr 12 1996 doc -rw-r--r-- 1 terry realaudio 1247 Apr 26 1996 readme.txt -rw-r--r-- 1 terry realaudio 931 Nov 10 03:58 server.cfg drwxr-xr-x 2 terry realaudio 512 Nov 10 03:59 logs barton# pwd /usr/local/realaudio/pnserver barton#"}, {"response": 21, "author": "terry", "date": "Thu, Jan  9, 1997 (23:10)", "body": "And the ra files thems are on www.spring.com: total 3920 -rw-rw-r-- 1 terry bbs 1170148 Dec 30 00:37 cinderella.ra -rw-rw-r-- 1 terry bbs 812644 Dec 30 00:49 princess.ra bash$ pwd /var/www/webdocs/childrenstory.com/sounds bash$"}, {"response": 22, "author": "ces", "date": "Fri, Jan 10, 1997 (22:25)", "body": "Hi folks, this is Chris Spurgeon in Philadelia. The Real Audio server is up and running. Give me a yell (at ces@whyy.org) if you have any problems or questions. One thing though, I think there may be something wrong with the two files cinderella.ra and princess.ra. They don't play through the RA system (they HAVE been passed through a RealAudio encoder, haven't they?) The RA server plays the test files and one that I downloaded from my site just fine. And conversely, I uploaded a copy of princess.ra to my site and my RA server couldn't handle it either, so I think it must be a file problem. Chris"}, {"response": 23, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sat, Jan 11, 1997 (10:23)", "body": "Chris - Thanks so much for your help on this! I know that Terry is experiencing a hugh sigh of relief!!"}, {"response": 24, "author": "terry", "date": "Sat, Jan 11, 1997 (12:22)", "body": "I sure am! I'll see about those ra files."}, {"response": 25, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Jan 12, 1997 (05:43)", "body": "RA works! Only the princess.ra file is not Princess and the Pea. Sounds pretty good. Who fixed it? Terry, did you encode and move it?"}, {"response": 26, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Jan 12, 1997 (05:48)", "body": "No, did not have to move it to the dir Chris specified. Messed up -- skipping at the end -- though."}, {"response": 27, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan 12, 1997 (08:02)", "body": "What is the princess.ra file then?"}, {"response": 28, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sun, Jan 12, 1997 (10:54)", "body": "Amy - How did you play it? If I go to the link on childrenstory.com, I still just get text. I've gone over to the RA site, and can play their files without a problem, but not this one. BTW, Didn't you say in chat last night that you don't have sound?"}, {"response": 29, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Jan 12, 1997 (11:12)", "body": "Oh I have sound I am just a little afraid of the complexity of it and also of the danger of falling liking it too much. I don't know why or how it worked. I am not even quite sure how to describe what I did so that it will give you clues. I chose the \"open\" rather than \"save\" download option, if that makes any difference. Terry, the story Jonathan's friend read, I think, is Puss n Boots."}, {"response": 30, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan 12, 1997 (12:33)", "body": "OK, is Puss n Boots complete? Are any excerpts of Jane Austen's writing suitable for this site?"}, {"response": 31, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan 12, 1997 (12:34)", "body": "What do we need to do to get this ra files to work. Perhaps we should enlist Chris again for this final phase. I'd really like to see these working by tonight so I could invoice Jonathon. He's hot for realaudio."}, {"response": 32, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Jan 12, 1997 (13:04)", "body": "He invited us to mail him with any questions."}, {"response": 33, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Jan 12, 1997 (13:58)", "body": "] OK, is Puss n Boots complete? No. The beginning is missing and it skips during the 2nd half ] Are any excerpts of Jane Austen's writing suitable for this site? No. It is pretty hard going. But material is not a problem. I will do more on my story today. Have someone in mind to record, but there's so little budget. I think you need to charge more for these services, Terry. Of course, we have to be able to deliver, too. Need to talk to you about Texaltel too. Talked to Sheri."}, {"response": 34, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan 12, 1997 (14:23)", "body": "We can get additional budget for childrenstory if get realaudio working. Chris is going to take a look at our code in about an hour from now. I put up a temporary link to all the ra files on the front page. It seems that you have to reference to a text file called .ram that references to the .ra file. I'm a bit off in my referencing still. Take a look at the source code there and you'll see what I mean. www# ls -ralt total 3247 drwxrwsr-x 6 root bbs 1024 Jan 4 13:17 .. -rw-rw-r-- 1 terry bbs 1170148 Jan 11 15:16 cinderella.ra -rw-r--r-- 1 terry bbs 643060 Jan 11 15:21 cinderella2.ra -rw-rw-r-- 1 terry bbs 740408 Jan 11 16:14 princess.ra -rw-r--r-- 1 terry bbs 591076 Jan 12 13:24 sleeping.ra -rw-r--r-- 1 terry bbs 109540 Jan 12 13:26 welcome28.ra -rw-r--r-- 1 root bbs 49 Jan 12 13:54 cinderella.ram -rw-r--r-- 1 root bbs 50 Jan 12 13:54 cinderella2.ram -rw-r--r-- 1 root bbs 47 Jan 12 13:56 sleeping.ram -rw-r--r-- 1 root bbs 48 Jan 12 13:57 welcome28.ram drwxrwsr-x 2 terry bbs 512 Jan 12 13:57 . -rw-r--r-- 1 root bbs 35 Jan 12 14:01 princess.ram www# pwd /usr/var/www/webdocs/childrenstory.com/sounds www# cat cinderella.ram pnm://www.childrenstory.com/sounds/cinderella.ra www# cat cinderella2.ram pnm://www.childrenstory.com/sounds/cinderella2.ra www# cat sleeping.ram pnm://www.childrenstory.com/sounds/sleeping.ra www# cat princess.ram pnm://www.spring.com/princess.ra"}, {"response": 35, "author": "ces", "date": "Sun, Jan 12, 1997 (15:38)", "body": "Hi folks, it's Chris again. I think everything is hunky dory now (though I think there's something wrong with file called \"sleeping.ra\". I've e-mailed Terry with the details. Also hit him with a few paragraph primer on how this whole RealAudio thing works. For more info, check out the RA help pages at http://www.realaudio.com/help/library/ And let me re-iterate the standing invitation to email me with problems at ces@whyy.org PS> 12 degrees in Philadelphia right now. Austin sounds pretty nice today."}, {"response": 36, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan 12, 1997 (16:09)", "body": "Yeah, about 30 right now. Check out the front page of http://www.childrenstory.com Chris. I'm getting an error code when I try to click on some of the files."}, {"response": 37, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sun, Jan 12, 1997 (17:44)", "body": "Terry - Since the other files didn't work, I removed the links to them. You can test them out by going directly into the http://www.childrenstory.com/sounds directory."}, {"response": 38, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan 12, 1997 (17:52)", "body": "I'm ftping new versions as we speak. They're big files so it takes a while. I wonder how you stream real time audio into real audio. I'd like to be able to talk right into the website and broadcast live events."}, {"response": 39, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan 12, 1997 (17:52)", "body": "I just gave our bbs group permission to write into the rafiles directory: www# pwd /usr/var/www/rafiles www# cat /etc/group wheel:*:0:root,matt,terry,thalerd,janc,kaylene,dbii,greg,paul,austen,bubbi,myretta,amy,kaffeine,mrobens,dutchman,ces daemon:*:1:daemon kmem:*:2:root sys:*:3:root tty:*:4:root operator:*:5:root uucp:*:6: bin:*:7: news:*:8 : utmp:*:12: games:*:13: mail:*:14: bbs:*:15:paul,terry,pwalhus,matt,thalerd,janc,dbii,amy,mhc,jwinsor,mrobens,mich,kendall,kaffeine staff:*:20:root bsdi:*:30: realaudio:*:31:terry,matt,paul,jonathon,tvpc www:*:84:terry,paul,matt netrabbit:*:99: user:*:100: dialer:*:117: netdial:*:118:matt nogroup:*:32766: www# pwd /usr/var/www/rafiles www# chgrp -R bbs /usr/var/www/rafiles www# chmod -R g+w /usr/var/www/rafiles www# find /usr/var/www/rafiles -type d -print | xargs chmod g+ws www# pwd /usr/var/www/rafiles www# ls BOFA961220_144.ra cinderella2.ra princess2.ra welcome144.ra cinderella.ra princess.ra sleeping.ra welcome144.ram cinderella.ram princess.ram sleeping.ram www# cp sleeping.ra sleeping2.ra www#"}, {"response": 40, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan 12, 1997 (18:01)", "body": "More from Chris: I found a typo in one of the web server conf files (my fault!) and fixed it. To prove that the RA server works, I made a web page in www.childrenstory.com called \"chris.html\" with a couple of links to rafiles. One of the files is a \"Best of Fresh Air\" file that I copied from the WHYY server to your machine, and that plays OK. The other link is to your sleeping beauty story and that doesn't seem to work. I think you haven't done the RealAudio encoding properly, or didn't upload it to your site properly, or something. Do you still have the original audio file? IF so, try running it through your RealAudio encoder and see if the resulting file plays OK on your local PC, before you move it onto the net. There were/are a few other problems to be dealt with. Here they are (in no particular order)... 1) Right now, when you reboot www.spring.com, the RealAudio server won't automaticly start up. You have to restart it manually. It's easy to do. Just become root on the machine and type in these two commands... cd /usr/local/realaudio/pnserver bin/pnserver server.cfg And it'll start right up. (You can change things so the RAserver starts up automaticly whenever you reboot. I think all that you do is add a line in the /etc/rc file on your system, but my UNIX system configuration chops are, let us say, minimal, socheck with your local UNIX guru or the well UNIX conference first!) 2) Your webpage links point to what's called a \"metafile\". This is a simple text file with one line in it, a line that contains the URL of the actual Real Audio file that you want to play. The names of all of these metafiles should end in \".ram\" (just like html files should end in \".htm\" or \".html\"). Those metafiles can be located anywhere on your server that a regular html file can reside. The line that each metafile contains looks like this... pnm://www.story.com/raFilenameGoesHere.ra If you look at the source for \"chris.html\" you'll see what I mean. 3) Remember ALL RealAudio files MUST end in \".ra\" and they MUST be inside of the directory /usr/var/www/rafiles That's what's known at the document root for the RealAudio server. When you make a metafile that has a line like... pnm://www.spring.com/foobar.ra ...the RA server goes to /usr/var/www/rafiles and looks there for a file called \"foobar.ra\". It DOESN'T look in /usr/var/www/docs or /usr/var/www/webdocs. The RA server doesn't even know those directories exist. The RealAudio server comes with a couple of documents explaining all of this in more detail, and giving some tips for creating the best possible sound. They're in Adobe Acrobat (.pdf) format and they're on your machine in the /usr/local/realaudio/pnserver/doc directory. You should also check out the online manuals. They're at http://www.realaudio.com/help/library/ Chris, you're welcome to put up an ad pointing to your Realaudio file on childrenstory.com. Jonathon said that would be fine. Thanks for all your help!"}, {"response": 41, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan 13, 1997 (03:43)", "body": "We're still not home yet. I had 3 14.4 kbaud ra files up perfectly and couldn't get them to work before I left for work. I won't be able to be at a machine where I can do realaudio for a while, I'm pretty sure this is a path or permissions problem. Amy and Kaf, will you please look at the code and see what is going on. It may be something very minor. I tested the ra files and the 14.4 kbaud files will work on 28.8 but not vice versa. I'm hoping we can define the process of creating realaudio files so that this will not be such an ordeal in the future."}, {"response": 42, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Mon, Jan 13, 1997 (18:45)", "body": "Terry - They are working. However, the sound quality of cinder14.ra is so bad as to be unusable. There are two files associated with RealAudio - *.ram and *.ra. The ram file is an ascii file containing one line: pnm://www.spring.com/filename.ra This is located in any directory you want and tells the RealAudio player where to find the actual sound file. For example, a link to a RealAudio clip on childrenstory.com would be http://www.childrenstory.com/sounds/filename.ram The .ra file is the actual sound file, and must be located in /usr/var/www/rafiles/filename.ra"}, {"response": 43, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sat, Jan 18, 1997 (15:05)", "body": "I went to Circuit City today to check out childrenstory.com on WebTV. I learned a couple of interesting things. 1) Smaller is better. Right now just about all our text is too big. I'm going to reduce the text size on everything I've done. 2) RealAudio, which is a helper app in Netscape, is a plug-in on WebTV - so no program is launched, it just plays the audio immediately. It will be perfectly suited to my idea of stories where they can click on individual words to hear them pronounced. Overall, I was impressed with it. It is definately a viable option for people who want to play on the internet, but don't want or can't afford a computer. I'm going to check the WebTV website (I assume there is one), and see what other plug-ins come with it. It would be very nice if we could use Shockwave on the site. I did forget to check on how well it works in environments like spring or Pemberley. If you guys get a chance to check it out, I would appreciate any feedback on that."}, {"response": 44, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sat, Jan 18, 1997 (16:41)", "body": "Serendipidously, look what was in my inbox: This Week in Web Review: How to Design for WebTV, (And Whether You Should Bother.) http://webreview.com"}, {"response": 45, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan 19, 1997 (11:49)", "body": "More important than making any additions on this site is the following: 1. get realaudio tied to the pictures as opposed to text stories without pictures and pictures without stories. 2. pull cinderella pictures out of the images subdirectory stored on the site. Or find some better Cinderella images somewhere else that are royalty free or minimal royalty. 3. integrate advertising on the site. Use dummy ones or find someone who wants an ad. We could use the radio station stuff in the audio file. Make it look like the nice stuff you see on CNN or Disney. Advertising on every page. 4. When you go to childrenstory from tvpc the bar across the bottom dissappears and it should stay there. Does everyone have write access to tvpc? If not, we need to set permissions. 5. reformat the pages that don't fit (eg. Princes and the Pea-, there are only two of these."}, {"response": 46, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan 19, 1997 (11:57)", "body": "The above are Jonathon's priorities. After these are complete, he wants us to start implementing some of the new ideas."}, {"response": 47, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Jan 19, 1997 (15:33)", "body": "Okay, I am on it late tonight and tomorrow. Kaf or Terry, need to talk to you about encoding the CoolEdit files for RA."}, {"response": 48, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan 19, 1997 (16:16)", "body": "If you have cooledit, go to their website and make sure you have the ra file add on. What specific questions do you have?"}, {"response": 49, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sun, Jan 19, 1997 (17:05)", "body": "When you choose \"Save As\" in CoolEdit, there should be an option for RealAudio. If there isn't, you don't have the latest version."}, {"response": 50, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sun, Jan 19, 1997 (18:01)", "body": "I can work on your suggestions tonight and tomorrow. My friend is coming over tomorrow afternoon to record her stories. Before we do too much more, I wanted to talk to you about the directory structure on the site. I can't stand a messy web site!! (My home is another story...but we won't go into that) From our discussions, I think that we are looking at having 3 main areas to the site - 1) Fairy Tales 2) Nursury Rhymes (for pre-readers) 3) Interactive Stories So, I would like to propose that we create 3 new directories: tales rhymes stories Here's a visual representation of my proposal: So, \"Snow White and Rose Red\" would have a URL of: www.childrenstory.com/tales/rosered/index.html That way, when its time to rotate stock, instead of having all images or sounds in the same directory and having to figure out which files to delete, we can just delete (or archive) the entire directory structure for that particular story. Let me know if you have any objections to this directory structure."}, {"response": 51, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan 19, 1997 (18:26)", "body": "Not at all. We need to add structure as the site grows. The main priority is to first address the four items I outlined above. Then move on to these new areas."}, {"response": 52, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sun, Jan 19, 1997 (18:33)", "body": "I'd like to get the directory structure set right away too. The more we get in there, the harder it will be to do. It shouldn't take too long. I've copied some ads from disney.com and will use those images temporarily until we get real advertising, so that we can show what it will look like. As to the bottom frame from TVPC - I have bad news. You can't use frames for WebTV - those tags are not allowed. So you will have to rethink that site. Also, according to the documentation at http://webtv.net they recommend that you avoid making users scroll down - their research has shown that TV viewers don't understand or like scrolling. So you have to keep the content on each individual page to a minimum. This means that our homepage should include ONLY the logo, the links, and one advertisment. Anything more will take up too much room and cause scrolling. If we have to include TVPC stuff at the bottom, we will have to lose something else."}, {"response": 53, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan 19, 1997 (19:16)", "body": "These are good thoughts and I'll run them by Jonathon tonight. Let's get as many of the four fundamentals above done and the structure, then deliver a plan to Jonathon with a cost estimate of the next phase. Email regarding costs."}, {"response": 54, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Jan 19, 1997 (19:55)", "body": "Web TV may recommend not having pages that scroll, but are all set-top box people going to look exclusively at made-for WebTV content? We should follow the guidelines so people can use our stuff, but I have a feeling all this will change and evolve just like everything else on the web. Why, it was less than a year ago that a actually had an argument with somebody on an HTML list who insisted graphics as links should have a link border \"so people would know to click there.\" Imagine!"}, {"response": 55, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Jan 19, 1997 (19:56)", "body": "Kaf, how do you want to split up the 4 Jonathon points?"}, {"response": 56, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sun, Jan 19, 1997 (19:59)", "body": "No, they will certainly look at other pages as well, but since this site is specifically aimed at WebTV viewers, I think that we should try to follow their recommendations for effective WebTV sites. As viewers get more sophisticated, we may need to rethink the strategy. Nothing is ever written in stone on the internet. For now, however, I think we should go by their guidelines."}, {"response": 57, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sun, Jan 19, 1997 (20:00)", "body": "Amy - Meet me in the office?"}, {"response": 58, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan 20, 1997 (08:11)", "body": "I'll be off the web all day. But email will reach me. If you post anything here please also send a copy by email. That's the only way you'll reach me till about 8 pm tonight when I'll be checking in tonight. Occasionally, I get to check in from a web browsing station from work, but generally they're hard to get to."}, {"response": 59, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan 20, 1997 (08:18)", "body": "Jonathon's response: I forgot to leave the TV adapter out front, sorry! As for formating our sites simply to Web TV, ie without frames, I don't want to do that as Web TV will be upgrading it's browser to include frames. Secondly I don't mind if folks have to scroll downwards as they will have to do this on the majority of sites anyway. So lets not worry about that."}, {"response": 60, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Jan 20, 1997 (09:44)", "body": "Okay, so let's review where we are with Jonathon's critical list: 1. get realaudio tied to the pictures as opposed to text stories without pictures and pictures without stories. Kaf's voice, Susan, will re-record the bad RA files -- Puss 'N' Boots and Cinderella -- plus Kaf's new story, Rose Red, this afternoon, 1/20 My voice, Laura, will record the other two existing stories -- P&Pea and UgDuck -- plus my new story, The Frog Prince some evening this week, ASAP depending on her availability. 2. pull cinderella pictures out of the images subdirectory stored on the site. Or find some better Cinderella images somewhere else that are royalty free or minimal royalty. Let me get clear on this. Actually don't we need more than this? Text and pictures for not just Cinderella, but for Puss 'N' Boots and Sleeping Beauty as well? I will format these stories, in just a simple way for now, 1 pagers, with just a couple of pictures -- Kaff can you send me the text? Or is is somewhere on the system? I can do it by Wednesday. 3. integrate advertising on the site. Use dummy ones or find someone who wants an ad. We could use the radio station stuff in the audio file. Make it look like the nice stuff you see on CNN or Disney. Advertising on every page. Kaf has done this for the front page. 4. When you go to childrenstory from tvpc the bar across the bottom dissappears and it should stay there. Does everyone have write access to tvpc? If not, we need to set permissions. We have not assigned this responsibility. But I suppose the task will fall to Kaf for she is ten times as prett-- frames conversant as I. 5. reformat the pages that don't fit (eg. Princes and the Pea-, there are only two of these. Done, Kaf did UgDuck, I did P&Pea last night. We are coming along. It will happen."}, {"response": 61, "author": "terry", "date": "Tue, Jan 21, 1997 (21:57)", "body": "Once upon a time there was a beautiful girl called Cinderella and she had two ugly step sisters who were very unkind who made her do all the hard work. She had to sweep the floors, do all the dishes, while they dressed up in fine clothes and went to lots of parties. One day a special invitation arrived at Cinderella's house. It was from the royal palace. The king's only son was a truly handsome prince was going to have a grand ball. Three girls were invited to come. Cinderella knew she wouldn't be allowed to go to the ball. But the ugly sisters, ho ho ho, they were excited. They couldn't talk about anything else. When the day of the ball came, they made such a fuss. Poor Cinderella had to rush about upstairs and downstairs. She fixed their hair in fancy waves and curls. She helped them put on their expensive new dresses. And she arranged their jewels just so. As soon as they had gone, Cinderella sat down by the fire and she said. \"Oh I do wish I could go to the ball\". The next moment, staind beside her was a lovely old lady with a silver wand in here hand. \"Cinderalla, she said \" I am your fairy godmother and you shall go to the ball. But first you must go into the garden and pick a golden pumpkin, then bring me six mice from the mousetraps, a whiskered rat from the rat trap, and six lizards. You'll find the lizards behind the watering can. So Cinderella fetched a golden pumpkin, six grey mice, a whiskered rate, six lizards. The fairy godmother touched them with her wand and the pumpkin became a golden coach, the mice became six grey horses, the rat became a coachman with the most enormous moustache, and the lizards became six footmen dressed in green and yellow, then the fairy godmother touched Cinderella with the wand and her old dress became a golden dress sparkling with jewels while on her feet was the prettiest pair of glass slippers ever seen. Remember said the fairy godmother you must leave the ball before the clock strikes twelve because at midnight the magic ends. \"Thank you fairy godmother\" said Cinderella and she climbed into the coach. When Cinderella arrived at the ball she looked so beautiful that everyone wondered who she was! Even the ugly sisters. The Prince of course asked here to dance with him and they danced all evening. He would not dance with anyone else. Now Cinderella was enjoying the ball so much that she forgot her fairy godmothers warning until it was almost midnight and the clock began to strike. One. Two. Three. She hurried out of the ballroom. Four. Five. Six. As she ran down the palace steps one of her glass slippers fell off. Seven. Eight. Nine. She ran on toward the golden coach. Ten Eleven Twelve. Then there was Cinderella in her old dress. The golden pumpkin lay in her feet. And scampering down off down the road were six grey mice, a whiskered rat and six green lizards.. So Cinderella had to walk home and by the time the ugly sisters returned home was sitting quietly by the fire. Now when Cinderella ran from the palace, the prince tried to follow her and he found the glass slipper. He said, \"I shall marry the beautiful girl whose foot fits this slipper and only her. IN the morning the prince went from house to house with the glass slipper and every young lady tried to squeeze her foot into it. But it didnt' fit any of them. At last the prince came to Cinderella's house. First one ugly sister tried to squash her foot into the slipper. But her foot was too wide and fat. Then the other ugly sister tried but her foot was too long and thin. Please said Cinderella, let me try. \"The slipper won't fit you\", said the ugly sisters. \"You didn't go to the ball!\" But Cinderella slipped her foot into the glass slipper and it fit perfectly. The next moment standing beside her was the fairy godmother. She touched Cinderella with the wand and there she was in a golden dress sparkling with jewels and on her feet was the prettiest pair of glass slippers ever seen. The ugly sisters were so surprised that, for once they coulnd't think of anything to say. But the Prince knew what to say. He asked Cinderella to marry him. And then there was a happy wedding. Everyone who had gone to the ball was invited, even the ugly sisters. There was wonderful food, lots of music and dancing. And the Prince of course danced every dance with Cinderella. He would not dance with anyone else."}, {"response": 62, "author": "terry", "date": "Sat, Jan 25, 1997 (08:07)", "body": "The key question this weekend from JL: What's next? It's time to invoice him and get approval for what we're going to do next on the site."}, {"response": 63, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sat, Jan 25, 1997 (09:00)", "body": "Does he like it at all Terry?"}, {"response": 64, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sat, Jan 25, 1997 (11:04)", "body": "We've got several fairy tales - I think the next phase should be nursury rhymes. Also, I went back to the store to check out the redesigned pages on WebTV and discovered that we have more room to play with. While the 640x480, 18pt font, gives you a fairly accurate idea of the width of the screen, you actually get quite a bit more space top to bottom than the PC monitor shows you. So we can put more on a page without it scrolling than I thought! And to echo Amy - Have you had any positive feedback from Jonathan on this?"}, {"response": 65, "author": "terry", "date": "Sat, Jan 25, 1997 (18:41)", "body": "Can we work up a concrete proposal with stages and costs associated with each stage this weekend? I'd like to present it to him Monday night and take him an invoice for the work done up to date. That way we'll know where we stand."}, {"response": 66, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Jan 26, 1997 (08:11)", "body": "RE: real audio recording I tried CoolEdit last night to record P&theP(ea). 1. Terry or Kaf, do either of you have CoolEdit registered. Since we are using it for the same project, I don't see why we can't use the same registered copy. It would help to be able to use all the editing features at once. Anybody have a number? 2. I'm having trouble getting the level just right. Kaf, you and I have talked about maybe a cheap mic being a drawback. I have a little better mic than the one that comes with the computer, but I wonder if one made for MIDI might help with popping \"P's\" and hissing \"S's\" 3. There are ways to tone down those flaws, but I am a little lost in the world of amplitude and sampling and all. I am going to look for beginner's sound help on the web today. Meanwhile if you guys have some tips, I am in audio mode today."}, {"response": 67, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan 26, 1997 (09:27)", "body": "A better mike would help. Make sure you use metal oxide tape. And make sure you use a smapling rate of 11 22 or 44 I believe it isl. You'll have to experiment with settings till you find the best combination. Try different settings. I'll see about getting us some registered copies."}, {"response": 68, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Jan 26, 1997 (09:34)", "body": "Tape? Oh. I have been going direct to digital. Maybe that is the problem."}, {"response": 69, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sun, Jan 26, 1997 (11:31)", "body": "Well, I don't have the option of going to tape first - CD players galore, but no tape player here! As to registering Cool95: It has a major drawback - you cannot edit previously recorded RA files. It can save out to RA, but it can't read in RA. There is a product called Sound Forge http://www.sfoundry.com/pages/forge.htm that can do both, but it is expensive. Any other suggestions?"}, {"response": 70, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Jan 26, 1997 (16:40)", "body": "Yes, I would email the folks who put out Cooledit. Look it up on their website and tell them a. we would like a full version for an in depth review b. ask them for a link from their website to our discussion group (give them the read only url) c. ask them how to acheive the highest sound quality d. ask for references of some other users who know the product well, email them and ask them to join our conference. e. be sure to mention Stroud's links to our site, these are often the magic words in getting review product from vendors. I have had very good luck getting free full versions of products because of the service we are doing for them with our discussion groups linked to Stroud. If we need something more robust, let me know and get me download/ordering information and I'll get Jonathon to ok the expenditure."}, {"response": 71, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan 27, 1997 (08:43)", "body": "From Jonathon: For some of the RA stories we don't have the text, I need to give yoy the book with the stories so you can scan them in. (Text only, not pictures), to go along with Puss In Boots, The sleeping Beauty etc. I made a mistake in suggesting we put \"dummy\" ad's on the site. Perhaps we'd be better off placing a generic one on the pages that say's \"advertise here, call 512 302 1389 to find out more\". Hopefully we can have all this completed by next Friday? The Connect Zone : Telnet to thezone.com"}, {"response": 72, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Jan 27, 1997 (10:53)", "body": "Okay, there seems to have been a misunderstanding about our roles. Either that or plans have changed. I guess Kaf and I will be doing no recording at all now? I will have to pay my voice for the one story she has done, whether I am paid for it or not. That is the way I work."}, {"response": 73, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Jan 27, 1997 (13:37)", "body": "Well, even if I have wasted my time on the audio, I still want to learn how it works. I recorded in CoolEdit and saved as an .ra file. But the file still needs to be run through the encoder? When I try to do that, it tells me the file was done at the wrong sampling rate? Which rate did you guys use? When I went to the RA page for help on my error message #39, here, sadly, is all I learned: Error Messsage Not Defined This is an infrequently occuring error message, and therefore we have not provided a solution in this list. Please send e-mail to Technical Support using the Support Request and include the error message number as well as what you were doing just prior to the message appearing."}, {"response": 74, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan 27, 1997 (20:03)", "body": "We need to go to a purchase order system to avoid any misunderstandings about what needs to be done. Here's the process we have to go through: 1. Submit a detailed account of what is to be done and how much it will cost. 2. I will submit it to Jonathon. 3. When it is approved, I will give you a PO Number for the work. 4. The POs will be numbered sequentially. PO Number 1 and 2 are for $200 each. 1 is for Childrenstory and 2 is for Texaltel as we discussed. PO 1 - to kaf for childrenstory $200 PO 2 - to amy for texaltel $200 Please submit two new purchase orders covering what you have done beyone the intial two purchase orders even though you may have already done some of this stuff, I will get Jonathon to ok these and then I will invoice him. If it we do it this way from now on, there will be no room for misunderstanding or vagueness about what we're doing and how much it will cost. I have to do it this way, because Jonathon and Texaltel are paying for these projects and I can't authorize any work without their approval. Does this sound like a good procedure to follow?"}, {"response": 75, "author": "terry", "date": "Sat, Feb  8, 1997 (11:05)", "body": "Basically, Jonathon wants us to take charge of this site and clean up the details. One detail he keeps mentioning is editing the one sound file that has two stories in one. Kath or Amy, are either of you set up for editing ra sound files. I don't have a setup with sound right now and I'm working super long hours at work or I would do it myself."}, {"response": 76, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Sat, Feb  8, 1997 (19:10)", "body": "Sorry, Terry - I don't have the ability to do that (Cool96 will only save ra files, not read them in)."}, {"response": 77, "author": "terry", "date": "Sat, Feb  8, 1997 (21:42)", "body": "OK I'll find a set up locally and work on it."}, {"response": 78, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Feb  9, 1997 (18:55)", "body": "Laura Lemay has a great web tv site: http://www.minds.com/cgi-bin/maslink.cgi/command?content+edg+web"}, {"response": 79, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Feb 23, 1997 (16:44)", "body": "Jonathon's current requests: I want the site cleaned up, this means: *) Ensure that there is text on the pages that used to have text but now only have RA. *) Add some examples of Nursery and Interactive, even if they are only simple ones. Quite honestly Paul, I have never designed a site before so I look to you as the experienced person here to make it look and run at an exceptable level, by that I mean very profesional, not like it was built as a hobby. Also I have Win95 running on a TVPC, I would like you to come over and configure it so it can log into TVPC.com without all the password screens as we discussed previously. I can't do it today, Sunday, but one night in the week. How about Monday or Wednesday?"}, {"response": 80, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Mon, Feb 24, 1997 (19:34)", "body": "Per our discussion last night: Terry is getting the missing text. Amy is formatting the text once Terry gets it. Kathleen is adding the ads to the fairy tales. After these tasks are completed we will discuss adding new material to the site."}, {"response": 81, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Feb 24, 1997 (22:12)", "body": "In order to activate your new Easystart Server after downloading it, you will be required to enter a unique product installation number (below) for each copy which you are licensed to use. We strongly encourage you to print this page and save it for future reference. Easystart Audio License Key: CustomerName Spring 1000526 LicenseKey: 91000zad4080000240f818ba00003e0400600017a0000107100a7ca1204790000220e Billing Shipping Name: JR Langley JR Langley Company: Spring Spring Address: Rt 2 Box 56R Rt 2 Box 56R Cedar Creek, TX 78612 Cedar Creek, TX 78612 US US Phone: 512.303.4000 Email: terry@spring.com terry@spring.com Credit Card: AMEX #374588271401004 (Exp. 11/98) Quantity Item Unit Cost Cost 1 Easystart Server 295.00 295.00 1 Upgrades Only, no Technical Support 149.00 149.00 Sales Tax 0.00 Shipping 8.00 Total 452.00 For questions regarding this order, please contact us at (206) 674-2651. For technical support issues, contact us at (206) 674-2681. Your unique transaction number is: HDI01226302229706 Download Now Copyright \ufffd Progressive Networks, Inc., 1995-1997. All rights reserved. RealAudio is a registered trademark of Progressive Networks, Inc. RealVideo, RealPlayer, and the Real logo are trademarks of Progressive Networks, Inc."}, {"response": 82, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Feb 24, 1997 (22:18)", "body": "I've emailed Chris Spurgeon to ask him to help with the final leg of getting our Realaudio server back up and running after the license expired. The above email from Progressive Networks has all the license information."}, {"response": 83, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Mar  2, 1997 (13:52)", "body": "From Jonathon: Can we perleessee get text on Puss and Cinders! Why is it taking so long? I cannot use the site the way I want yet!!! I still do not have a finished product! My response: barton.spring.com is down right now, where the ra server is located, so I put the two ra files that I made in a directory called audio in /var/www/webdocs/childrenstory.com on www.spring.com So putting up these two ra files and putting text into Puss 'n Boots will make the site complete except for the two areas under construction. A while back I sent kaf the url for a site that has interactive stories, I wonder if we could get permission from these folks to republish a couple of these on our site just so we had some interactive content to satisfy Jonathon. I'm not sure where we can get some nursery rhymes, but I'll do some net searching on this today. Basically, we'll be complete with phase one and I can get paid if we: 1. install the two ra files I recorded (when the server comes back up) 2. put text in Puss 'n Boots 3. make sure the text is complete for Cinderella (I'm pretty sure it is but we need to check). 4. find some nusery rhyme content and put it up (get rid of \"under construction\") 5. find some interactive content and put it up (get rid of \"under construction\")"}, {"response": 84, "author": "Amy", "date": "Sun, Mar  2, 1997 (14:11)", "body": "Terry, I have not been so involved with this site as Kaf has, so maybe it is none of my business, but, I think he is wild and out of line. He or his buddy is the one who found the text originally. He's the one who should supply it for formatting. Kaf spent a lot of time searching for texts that did not match. He is making us run around in circles."}, {"response": 85, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Mar  2, 1997 (23:49)", "body": "I agree, but he's the customer and I'm trying to get this wrapped up. I need to find the url for the site with the interactive stories. deeper conference Main Menu"}]}, {"num": 4, "subject": "Texaltel - legislators websites", "response_count": 20, "posts": [{"response": 1, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (00:55)", "body": "Sherry is our main contact person at Texaltel. Charles Land is the director."}, {"response": 2, "author": "terry", "date": "Tue, Dec 31, 1996 (00:57)", "body": "http://www.spring.com/~texaltel/ The Spring presents . . . Internet Legislative Home Page Proposal Revised 12/2/96 after initial meeting with Sherry and Charles Concept - The Spring will create websites that TEXALTEL will offer to members of the Texas legislature home pages. The provisions of the page and access service would be donated as a public service in order to facilitate communications between legislator s and constituents. Specifications: Each member would be offered a home page. Content would be at the member's selection. A picture of the office holder would be standard. The Spring has a facility conveniently located on Congress Av which would take pictures of legislators with the State Capital as a backdrop if this were desired or the Spring would digitize a picture sent in by a legistlator. Each office holder would designate a staff person to be trained by the Spring and who would then be responsible for maintenance of the page on the Spring's Server. The Spring would provide all support. The Spring would design a home page once that can be cloned for all without customized design. This page may have some options that would let each Member customize the features that they want. Features to be provided by the Spring: Introductory picture and text, with options to use a table of contents to select subjects. Email capability to permit constituents to email the Member. A location for new information and/or hot topics which the office holder might want to use to communicate recent developments to constituents. a \"town hall\" section where current issues are presented, perhaps discussed by the Member, and constituents have an opportunity to make comments. Members should be able to select whether each topic's discussion is open where subsequent callers can s ee the earlier comments, or \"closed\", such that only the Member (or his or her staff) could view the comments. a conference with topics for each politician/candidate. The Spring is uniquely qualified in this area by it's already existing conferencing system that has been written up in Newsweek, the NY Times, the Austin American Statesman (three page feature artic le), Texas Monthly and other publications and which can be seen at http://www.spring.com . a dedicated website for http:// ? Each legislators website would be of the form http://?/politician (where politician is the name of the candidate). Access arrangements such that the member's staff can update the home page material and such that the member can access the email and chat functions from office or home, in district or in Austin. There may be interest in linking such that one member might be accessible from another's page. Collective \"delegation\" pages, where all members from a town or area are on one home page, with each of them having their own sub page and features as listed above, but with a common area with the same features listed above that would be accessible to all members of the delegation. The ability to hyperlink to other pages as well as to list the member's page elsewhere in the www. Texaltel projects that they may have as many as 100 members accept their offer. Their goals are: October 15th - identify interested vendors/members who want to participate in the design of the project and/or the delivery of the service. Establish preliminary budgets. October 15th - November 1st - Refine specifications, budget and work with prospective providers to develop a short list. November 1st - November 15th - refine the specifications and select vendors and/or members who will donate and/or provide the various aspects of the services. November 21st - present the concept to the TEXALTEL board for approval. Sign any necessary contracts and complete the development of literature publicizing the service. December 2nd - Initial payment, website design process begins. December 15th - completion of website, begin critique phase. January 1st - Availability of website January 15th - training of Texatel staff (probably sooner). January 15th - May 15th - limited support Payment schedule: $750 upon completion of the basic website, conferencing area, and test legislator website. $35 to set up additional legislators websites (single page) $10 per month to maintain each legislator webpage $35 per hour for any support beyond 1 hour"}, {"response": 3, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (16:31)", "body": "Terry & Amy - I wanted to touch base on this site. First: Terry, I assume that we are working on the same fee schedule (out of the $750) that we were on childrenstory.com? Second: You need us to create a homepage and a test legislator site, and you will be creating the conferencing area. Correct? Third: Amy - I know you've been working on austentest - Have you had a chance to do anything on this? I think we should meet at the office tonight about 10pm Eastern to discuss this site. I would like to get it done by this weekend."}, {"response": 4, "author": "Kaffeine", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (17:14)", "body": "Oops! I just realized that I can't make it at 10pm - how about 11pm Eastern instead?"}, {"response": 5, "author": "terry", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (22:40)", "body": "I'm here now."}, {"response": 6, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Jan  6, 1997 (02:17)", "body": "Terry, it won't win any awards but here is what you wanted: \"something by Monday.\" http://www.spring.com/~amy/texaltel/legstart.html"}, {"response": 7, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan  6, 1997 (20:30)", "body": "Thanks! I'll take a look right now!"}, {"response": 8, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan  6, 1997 (20:34)", "body": "Now take out the word Texaltel because they don't want their name in it. Make up a cool name or something (it's a legal issue) and create a conference for this website. Whatever you name it, make an account with that name, and place it in that account. Do you know how to use adduser?"}, {"response": 9, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan  6, 1997 (20:37)", "body": "Spoke to soon, you're way ahead of me, the site looks great. I wonder how they'll react to the fuzzy Texas thing, it's interesting, they'll love it or hate it. I can't make up my mind. Now I see you already created a conference. Thanks! I'll continue looking at it and give a more considered repsonse later on after I've had a better look. So far, I'm impressed."}, {"response": 10, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan  6, 1997 (20:48)", "body": "A name I thought of his texasgovt.com so you could create an account called texasgovt and put the site there. This is just an *example* think of something short, catchy and easy to remember that is not a registered domain that shows up in a whois search. If you can't come up with anything better, sue texasgovt, but I'm hoping you can come up with a better name. Brainstorm time. Great program on PBS now about women in computing. Have you ever heard of Amy Bruckmann who started the MIT MediaMOO? She was on there."}, {"response": 11, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Jan  6, 1997 (21:11)", "body": "Terry, aren't they obliged to say who they are? Special interest group, lobbying laws and all? They should check it out."}, {"response": 12, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan  6, 1997 (22:33)", "body": "They said to keep their name out of it at least in this demo site. Can you think of a name? We *urgently* need the services of someone who knows how to set up a realaduio server so childrenstory will work. Will you please put the word out and ask around tomorrow. Jonathan is pushing me hard on this."}, {"response": 13, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan 13, 1997 (05:22)", "body": "Amy, what's the feedback from Sherry. I suggested that she call you and get the url from you for the work you did."}, {"response": 14, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Jan 13, 1997 (07:55)", "body": "We are on track now. She did not know I was not on staff, that's why I wanted you to talk to her first and explain. But we are cool. She will be getting the info from the test senator soon. I understand now why they do not want an index page. Will revise and fill you in more."}, {"response": 15, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan 13, 1997 (16:23)", "body": "I left a message for Sherry at her house today. She's working from home. Icyyy here!"}, {"response": 16, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan 20, 1997 (08:14)", "body": "I put a gif in (of all places) the childrenstory site of Senator Lucio. And Sherry is going to be sending along some copy by email. Before we sign the final agreement, I would like to review it with y'all who are working on the site (Amy and Kath) because it involves compensation issues. There's a copy of it in the Texaltel account on wwww.spring.com."}, {"response": 17, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Jan 20, 1997 (10:40)", "body": "Before we sign the final agreement, I would like to review it with y'all who are working on the site (Amy and Kath) because it involves compensation issues. There's a copy of it in the Texaltel account on wwww.spring.com. It's the homepag2.txt file, Terry?"}, {"response": 18, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Jan 20, 1997 (10:55)", "body": "I put a gif in (of all places) the childrenstory site of Senator Lucio. __ Where, Terry? I don't see it anywhere -- not in /~child or in the /www/webdocs path."}, {"response": 19, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Jan 20, 1997 (22:16)", "body": "It is that file. I'll go look for it again and come back and post where it is."}, {"response": 20, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Jan 20, 1997 (22:46)", "body": "] look for it again and come back ___ Okay, th anks. deeper conference Main Menu"}]}, {"num": 5, "subject": "The Spring itself", "response_count": 7, "posts": [{"response": 1, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (14:43)", "body": "www.spring.com is not currently writing log files. access.spring.com is being rebuilt by Matt. Matt will be reinstalled makewebserver and makedns on access We are experimenting with setting up some dedicated domains on a Windows NT 4.0 Server at bastrop.net (austen.com and golftravel.net were set up today); they finally have their two ip servers registered with the Nic. (these domains should be resolving within a few days). We need a newuser script which works like this: 1. user signs in as new without a password 2. user answers questions derived from a text file 3. answers are written to a tab text file and an email is sent to the user. 4. The information necessary to create new accounts is stored ina script 5. sudoers run a program which reviews each new account and allows 3 actions: a. create the account b. nuke it c. put it on hold 6. an email is automatically sent out telling new users they have been accepted dereived from a text file. This needs to run in a telnet session and on the website."}, {"response": 2, "author": "Amy", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (06:00)", "body": "Terry, re the new user script. How tight is Dave with some of his other clients, like the Mac site which has invented a wheel similar to this already? Seems to me as if there could be some sharing among us."}, {"response": 3, "author": "terry", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (22:42)", "body": "The guy who does Gamespot is already helping us by setting up the newest version of Apache on http://access.spring.com He's Ian Kallen and he may turn out to be a terrific resource. His email is mailto://spidaman@well.com"}, {"response": 4, "author": "Amy", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (22:59)", "body": "Oh, I have seen him poking around in the shell."}, {"response": 5, "author": "terry", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (23:23)", "body": "Check out his yapp site, he's dealing with a lot of yapp issues: http://www.gamespot.com Should I invite him to this conference?"}, {"response": 6, "author": "Amy", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (23:25)", "body": "] invite him to this conference? __ Yes. Come Spidaman."}, {"response": 7, "author": "terry", "date": "Sat, Jan  4, 1997 (07:54)", "body": "I extended him an invitation, maybe Ian knows about mime types. deeper conference Main Menu"}]}, {"num": 6, "subject": "system administration and networking", "response_count": 5, "posts": [{"response": 1, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (11:50)", "body": "I need to know how to extract an email list of all the participants. And we need soem type of stats package."}, {"response": 2, "author": "terry", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (00:52)", "body": "Here's an email I got from Matt reporting on the progress on access: I finally got a chance to start on access after I replaced its power supply. The disk that's in the system seems to have problems, in that it spins up, but it never reports ready to the controller. If you listen to the disk, you can hear the heads click every couple of seconds, like they are trying to seek, but it keeps going through this cycle. Did you want me to give you back the drive, and you can take it back and get it traded or something? I don't know if this is a new drive, or one you had laying around. The drive reports to the controller that it's an HP drive of some model number, but always reports 'Not Ready' to any other SCSI commands. I have a spare Seagate 43400N, which is a full-height, 5-1/4\" 2.7GB drive that I have in a shoebox onto which I'm installing BSDI right now. I can loan you this drive for an indefinite period of time. Whenever you can get the drive replaced, I can transfer the system onto this drive, and I can take my drive back. I wanted to get your system ready for you by the end of the holidays, and haven't had hardly any time to be able to do it so far due to family being around and such. I'm leaving employment at Motorola as of January 10th, and will be starting employment at Tivoli Systems starting tomorrow, so for the next two or three weeks, I'm going to be extremely busy shuffling between two jobs, so its not likely I'll have a lot of time for much else. - -- - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Matt Ragan (matt@ibmoto.com) Motorola/IBM Somerset PowerPC Design Center Network Administrator Systems/Network Engineering (512) 424-8298 6300 Bridgepoint Pkwy, Bldg 4 Austin, Tx 78731 FAX (512) 424-8826 - --------------------------------------------------------------------------"}, {"response": 3, "author": "Amy", "date": "Mon, Dec 30, 1996 (21:13)", "body": "Terry, I do SPSS."}, {"response": 4, "author": "Amy", "date": "Thu, Jan 23, 1997 (20:24)", "body": "Terry, how does cgi work on www.spring.com -- CGI anywhere or in a bin only?"}, {"response": 5, "author": "terry", "date": "Thu, Jan 23, 1997 (21:04)", "body": "In a bin directory. I'm not a cgi expert though. deeper conference Main Menu"}]}, {"num": 7, "subject": "marketing and selling the Spring", "response_count": 2, "posts": [{"response": 1, "author": "Amy", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (06:15)", "body": "Terry, I've had some ideas about making this place more popular, but have hesitated to offer the ideas until we are a little more ready for a crowd. I've had some pretty good success with promoting my own sites (cool site mentions from HotWired, Microsoft Network, Prodigy, Yahoo, Excite, CSotD) and have even taught a seminar about web site promotion for Bluemarble. Also spent 15 years in PR . One thing I can do is revitalize my nap advocacy site http://www.bluemarble.net/~amyloo/wno.html , which is not fully functioning right now; I have all but abandoned it since getting on this P&P kick. I could invite visitors to come over here and talk about naps. I have some ideas about other less general -- w-a-a-a-y less general --- topics because I think esoteria is the charm of the web. Look how narrow addicts to one mini series is, as a topic. But it bring like people together. New members say things like, \"Thank God . I am not alone. I know I have had at least a dozen ideas for new conferences but can't call them all up at the moment. Here is one: - A platform wars plug-in for any usenet group, email or web discussion group. Promote it as the place to which people wanting to argue (about, say PC vs Mac or Unix vs anything else) should be sent so as not to poison otherwise friendly communities."}, {"response": 2, "author": "terry", "date": "Fri, Jan  3, 1997 (22:44)", "body": "Hmmm, what are some of your other ideas? You have my curiosity piqued! Where can we go with the apps conference? Have you looked at it as well as the custom interface to it? deeper conference Main Menu"}]}, {"num": 8, "subject": "accounting - what the Spring costs and its revenues", "response_count": 2, "posts": [{"response": 1, "author": "terry", "date": "Sun, Dec 29, 1996 (10:09)", "body": "Here is the January projection: projected income for January childrenstory 750 Texaltel 750 owner contribution 500 2000 expenses T-1 connection Prismnet 400 T-1 connection Bastrop IS 100 telephone 100 office rent 350 html authoring 500 system admin 200 domain registrations 350 2000"}, {"response": 2, "author": "terry", "date": "Sat, Jan  4, 1997 (07:55)", "body": "Eventually Dave wants $1,000 from me for yapp. He's been pretty flexible about waiting until I can pay. deeper conference Main Menu"}]}, {"num": 9, "subject": "The apps conference", "response_count": 0, "posts": []}]}