Please someone advise me as to what the gravy as in "biscuits and gravy" involves. It seems to be a white gravy but has some sort of flavoring.

And, while we're at it, what is the difference between Cajun and Creole? I see seafood balls made in both flavorings.

Do they ever serve mixed greens? I notice they sell "greens" in cans. I am guessing they are collard greens (whatever a collard is...)

i guess that because it is cheaper thats what people do

I'd have thought they would go pick their own greens. Most things look edible that I pull from my garden. Probably more edible than what I amgrowing!

When I lived in Tennessee, we had a collard patch. Hmm, not a bad idea. Maybe I'll start one here in Texas. It's been years since I've had a garden, maybe it's time to go "back the to garden". We're getting inspiration to do more planting from Kelly, our friend in Bastrop who collects and freely distributes native plants to his friends.

I also have a friend who is crossbreeding heirloom tomatoes. I love that thought but will not try anything before we move to Tennessee.

You are moving to Tennessee??

Oh yes! Around Manchester, TN most likely. Seems there are old family ties there, so I am along for the ride. I wonder what hillbilly redneck (not my term - HIS!) cooking is like... and what is red-eye gravy?

Last summer we sponsored a youth group of teens from Manchester to run our Vacation Bible School. They were here for 10 days, and we put them up in our homes (I had a mom and her son). They were really nice people, great kids.

Manchester is a happening place. I'll be back there in August for his family reunion and cemetary decorating and picnic. (Yes, they do that in the South!) I've met only the nicest people in Manchester. I am looking forward to living there instead of battling our way through Nashville to get there. I just wish it had better rocks! Now I am supposed to learn how to grow okra so I can fry it. OK... but no red eyes for the gravy...

BTW, Bod Dylan and a bunch of rockers will be putting on Bonnaroo which will bring upwards of 60,00 fans to tiny Manchester. It has been a huge success the years it has been held. Watch for it! (Tickets for this are $275.00 !!!) 2004 Bonnaroo Artists Lineup The 2004 Bonnaroo lineup has been confirmed. The 2004 Bonnaroo schedule includes: Dave Matthews The Dead Bob Dylan Trey Anastasio Willie Nelson David Byrne Primus Wilco Ani DiFranco Gov't Mule Los Lobos Burning Spear moe. Galactic Yo La Tengo Femi Kuti Medeski Martin & Wood Gomez Yonder Mountain String Band Damien Rice North Mississippi Allstars Country Hill Review Beth Orton My Morning Jacket Gillian Welch The Del McCoury Band Taj Mahal Sam Bush Band Vida Blue feat. The Spam Allstars Los Lonely Boys Grandaddy King of Leon Bill Laswell's Material Soulive Neko Case Calexico Leftover Salmon Cut Chemist Chris Robinson & The New Earth Mud Umphrey's McGee Maroon5 The Black Keys Tokyo Ska Paradise Orchestra The Bad Plus Mark Broussard Donovan Frankenreiter Ween The Jazz Mandolin Project Jo Jo and his Mojo Mardi Gras Band Guster Patti Smith and Her Band The Radiators Hackensaw Boys New Monsoon

I'm so glad to see these posts from you. My e-mail is not working so I can't send anything.

What's wrong with your email? We finally have a robust email and webmail system at Spring with great anti-spam features. I've been wanting to get this running for a while. Finally, it's a reality.

lolol. Food Walrus? Are you beginning to resemble one or just using your name in an inventive way? (I remember Nan and the original Drooleurs doing such things)

Hi Lucie! I was just talking about you a few days ago.....long story but all complimentary!

I resemble that remark ;-)

You? Tall and debonnaire? Svelte, even! I cannot remotely imagine you like a walrus, but it makes for interesting musing during traffic stops.

I consulted a Tennessee lady who has fried okra for over 50 years and her comment was to fry it until the cornmeal coating was brown. That was exactly the problem with the stuff I tried in a restaurant. It had not been in the fryer long enough. I finally found out why they add potash or lye (or ashes) to hominy. It seems the Indians (Native Americans) discovered that the niacin in corn was unusable by the human body unless it had been "limed" I wonder how they knew? I still think it tastes funny, but it is much better for you if the niacin problem is true. Bert Wolf told me on his "Taste of America" PBS television program. Now you know.

Just toss the okra in a frying pan with oil and then sprinkle corn meal over it?

apparently that changes with the cook. Coat it before you put it in the pan -either first with milk then cornmeal or just dredge it in plain cornmeal. I'll let you know what works best.

I wonder how okra breaded with nutritional yeast would be?

Oooh that sounds good, actually. Okra does not have as much of a taste as it has a feel. To me it tastes "green" like grass, sort of.

Can someone tell me how nutritional yeast tastes, please? Is it different from activated or live yeast in blocks (not very tasty in that form)

Red Star flake nutritional yeast, I know I've said this before, is pretty good on popcorn or you can fry slices of tofu and bread them with it.

i like fried okra but i think you bread it before throwing it in the oil ;-) marcia, i posted a link about cajun/creole in the helpful hints topic.... am not one for biscuits and gravy--just looks like someone hurled and i can't get over that. greens - from what i understand, some are more bitter than others, so the flavor really depends on which one you use (mustard, turnip, collard) and how you cook it. the AM made a really good hamhock green for Thanksgiving - it was good when you put it over rice (i know we had mustard greens but he used a couple of different types).

hamhocks are terrific with greens - even green beans which is how I had it as a child. I'd eat just about anything cooked with hamhocks!! Amen on the biscuits and gravy. I'm still trying to figure why they bread "chicken fried steak" in the first place. Cardiologists should love it.

from http://whatscookingamerica.net/ Chicken-Fried Steak � It is also known as Country-Fried Steak and affectionately called �CFS� by Texans. There is no chicken in Chicken-Fried Steak. It is tenderized round steak (a cheap and tough piece of beef) made like fried chicken with a milk gravy made from the drippings left in the pan. Although not official, the dish is considered the state dish of Texas. According to a Texas Restaurant Associate, it is estimated that 800,000 orders of Chicken-Fried Steak are served in Texas every day, not counting any prepared at home. Every city, town, and village in Texas takes prides in their CFS. Some, admittedly, are better than others. Texans have a unique way of rating restaurants that serve CFS. The restaurants are rated by the number of pickup trucks that is parked out in front. Never stop at a one pickup place, as the steak will have been frozen and factory breaded. A two and three pickup restaurant is not much better. A four and five pickup place is a must stop restaurants, as the CFS will be fresh and tender with good sopping gravy. 1844-1850 - The origin of the Chicken-Fried Steak probably comes from the German people who settled in Texas from 1844 to 1850. As Wiener Schnitzel is a popular German dish that is made from veal, and because veal was never popular in Texas and beef was, the German immigrants probably adapted their popular dish to use the tougher cuts of beef available to them.

and from http://southernfoodways.com/ Chicken-Fried Steak: In Texas, It�s Not Just for Dinner by Jeff Seigel Debbie Morgan doesn�t understand why chicken-fried steak has such a poor reputation elsewhere in the country. �It gets a lot of respect here,� says Morgan, who is one of the managers at the 23-table Caf� 290 in tiny Manor, Texas, population 1,200�and where it�s the most popular item on the menu. �I suppose, if you don�t know any better, it does sound kind of icky, kind of like deep fried hamburger.� But the customers there do know better. Caf� 290, on U.S. Hwy. 290 just east of Austin, serves a steady stream of residents, jaded Austinites who are tired of eating nouvelle Texas, and others yearning for a menu that can best be described as classic Texas diner�fried catfish, Tex-Mex-style enchiladas, and, of course, chicken-fried steak. Caf� 290 is a Mecca for chicken-fried aficionados who are tired of frozen patties covered with soggy breading that�s never cooked correctly or who must endure national chains covering their misdeeds with pools of greasy, tasteless gravy. Caf� 290, along with places like Vern�s in Dallas, Threadgill�s in Austin, Massey�s in Fort Worth, and Goodson�s in Houston, should be mandatory stops on the chicken-fried trail. Yes, chili gets more publicity and barbecue attracts more controversy, but chicken-fried steak is more likely to be recognized as the national dish of Texas�served with white gravy, of course (unless one is feeling adventurous, and then it is smothered in chili, cheese and onions). At Caf� 290, there is chicken-fried steak for breakfast (with two eggs, grits, and biscuits). There is chicken-fried steak for lunch (check out the Wednesday buffet, served with two vegetables, for $5.95). There is chicken-fried steak for dinner, served in two sizes � large, and twice as large. All told, not including the buffet, the restaurant sells almost 400 orders a week. And Morgan is probably correct about the name. One reason that those unfamiliar with the dish tend to shy away from it is that it doesn�t sound like what it is�a piece of beef, double dipped in egg wash and flour and then deep fried until crisp, probably no more than two or three minutes. Just like fried chicken, but who would assume that anyone would cook beef that way? And, though there is agreement on this basic outline, there are many variations. Some argue that true chicken-fried should never see a deep fat fryer, but should be pan fried on top of the stove in a cast iron skillet (which is how Morgan makes hers at home). Then, it�s easy to throw some flour in the drippings to make the gravy. And though cube steak is the most common beef used, others insist on round steak (beaten first with a cast iron skillet) or even sirloin. Something to consider the next time you�re in Texas for breakfast.

and, finally, from http://foodtimeline.org/ Chicken fried steak The history of chicken fried steak (aka country fried steak) is a fabulous example of cultural diversity, regional pride and just plain confusion. Why? Because there are as many names/recipes for this dish as people who claim they know how it started. That's part of what makes the study of food history so interesting. As is true with many popular foods we know today, the recipe preceded the name. Food historians generally agree the practice of dredging meat (all kinds) in flour/spices, frying/baking it up and serving it with a sauce/gravy dates back to ancient times. This cooking method tenderizes the meat and enhances its flavor. Think Wiener schnitzel. Europeans who settled in America knew all about making tough cuts of meat palatable. Many historic American cookbooks contain "chicken-fried" type recipes for beef, veal, chicken & lamb, though they go by different names. Veal is traditionally considered to be a tough cut of meat and was often cooked in such a way as to make it more tender, as in weiner schnitzel. Sensible American cooks would have treated tough cuts of beef in a similar fashion. The chicken connection? Some food historians suggest the coating and pan-fried cooking technique commonly used on fried chicken was easily adapted to tenderize steak. In America, country fried steak is generally considered to be a regional dish. It is commonly found in the southern and central western states. The meat used for this American dish is always beef, the cuts vary. The "chicken-fried" moniker seems to be a mid-20th century invention. The earliest printed recipe we have for in chicken-fried steak was published in 1949. What the food historians say: "Chicken-fried steak...A beefsteak that has been tenderized by pounding, coated with flour or batter, and fried crisp. The name refers to the style of cooking, which is much the same as for southern fried chicken. Chicken-fried steak has been a staple dish of the South, Southwest, and Midwest for decades, although it dates in print only to 1952." ---Encyclopedia of American Food and Drink, John F. Mariani [Lebhar-Friedman:New York] 1999 (p. 72) "Chicken-fried steak...dating back to the times when beef was not nurtured with tender, loving care, steak identified as chicken-fried or country-fried, or sometimes smothered, can be prepared with any cut of beef but is obviously no better than the quality of the piece chosen. It is still popular in the South and West, especially at roadside eating places." ---American Food: The Gastronomic Story, Evan Jones, 2nd edition [Vintage Books:New York] 1981(p. 275) [includes recipe] "Chicken-fried steak...Particularly popular in the South and Midwest, this dish is said to have been created to use inexpensive beef." ---Food Lover's Companion, Sharon Tyler Herbst, 3rd edition [Barrons:New York] 2001 (p. 126) "Chicken-fried steaks...I have never seen a recipe for chicken-fried steaks. It is my conjecture that the name came about years ago when it was impossible to get beefsteaks of good quality in the rural South...I believe Swiss steaks had more or less the same origin. After the steaks were fried they were covered with a sauce of tomatoes, carrots, celery, and peas and baked until fork-tender." ---Craig Claiborne's The New York Times Food Encyclopedia, Craig Claiborne[Times Books:New York] 1985 (p. 86) What the regional people say: "The basic recipe for country-fried steak, for example, includes lightly floured steak sauteed and then baked in the oven. It's smothered with brown gravy and onions. Chicken-fried steak, on the other hand, uses breading similar to that for chicken before it's fried in a skillet. It's topped off with a cream gravy." ---"Folks from 'round here know down-home cooking," The Augusta (Ga.) Chronicle, April 7, 2000, Pg. O2 "Of course, there's chicken fried steak, another Texas curiosity. Not the dish, but the name. But battered and pan-fried beef steak is a home-cooking tradition in many regions. It goes by different names - country-fried steak, for example - in different parts of the country." ---"Dallas' signature foods: not what you'd expect," The Dallas Morning News, September 29, 1993, Pg. 2F "For the sake of argument, let's say a chicken-fried steak is a piece of beef, dipped in a mixture of egg and milk, dredged in seasoned flour and either pan-fried or deep-fried in hot oil, shortening or drippings. Let's also assume the great majority of chicken-fried steaks are served on top of or underneath a ladle of cream gravy, and usually sits next to a big helping of mashed potatoes. Although chicken-fried steak is considered a Southern staple, and most assuredly holds elite status in nearly any Oklahoma diner, its written history surprisingly dates to only about 1950." ---"Batter up Texas has the longhorn. Kansas City the strip. But we've got chicken fry." Tulsa World, December 22, 2000 "Matt's El Rancho [restaurant] opened in 1952 at 302 E. 1st. [Austin, TX]. The original menu consisted of only blue plate specials such as chicken fried steak." Matt's El Rancho "The German-Austrian dish is an illustrious forebear to our chicken-fried steak. German immigrants brought the breaded and fried cutlet to the Texas frontier, where it was quickly copied -with less finesse-by chuck-wagon cooks and farm wives trying to make a tough cut of beef more palatable. Even the gravy ladled on top has Teutonic roots: Rahmschnitzel is garnished with cream sauce. Schnitzel is German for cutlet. It is most often made from veal, but pork and, less frequently, beef also are used. Though there are many variations, the most popular is probably Wiener schnitzel, a crisply coated cutlet served plain except for a squeeze of lemon." ---"Plate Teutonics; Hofstetter's Wiener schnitzel is a cut from history," The Dallas Morning News, January 23, 1994, Pg. 21 "According to the Lone Star Book of Records, the CFS was invented in 1911 by Jimmy Don Perkins, a cook in a small cafe in Lamesa, Texas, who misunderstood a customer's order and battered a thin steak and deep-fried it in hot oil. Unfortunately this oft-reported food fact is a complete fable. Nobody is really sure when the CFS was invented, but it was long before 1952. In the Best Read Guide to San Antonio, Carol B. Sowa reports that the Pig Stand Drive-in locations in San Antonio started serving chicken-fried steak sandwiches when they opened in the 1940s. Gourmet columnists Jane and Michael Stern speculate in Eat Your Way Across the U.S.A. that the chicken-fried steak was a Depression-era invention of Hill Country German-Texans. My own guess is that the dish existed as beefsteak Wiener schnitzel long before the catchy Southern name was coined." ---Houston Press, January 11, 2001 "It was in this restaurant where the famous Fred Hill Steak was invented by Fred Hill. This steak is a round steak dipped in batter and flour and other secret ingredients, then fried in a skillet on the stove. This may sound like a Chicken Fried Steak, however, there is no comparison with the original Fred Hill Steak and a chicken fried steak. This secret recipe was handed down to Fred's daughter-in-law, Esther V. Hill of Portal, North Dakota and lately passed on to Fred's grandson Robert Hill. For may years the son's of Kenneth Hill would make the long journey to Portal to take in the famous steak invented by their grandfather, kept alive by their father Kenneth Hill, cooked by their mother Esther Hill and enjoyed by all." ---Frederick Hill Family About Germans in Texas We checked several historic [American] Southern cookbooks for chicken-fried and/or country-fried steak and found many recipes that would approximate the recipe in question, all under different names: 1824--The Virginia Houswife, Mary Randolph ---A Fricando of Beef (p. 41); Beef steaks (p. 44) 1871--Mrs. Porter's New Southern Cookery Book, Mrs. M. E. Porter ---Beefsteak with onions (p. 76-77); Beef cakes (p. 79) 1877--Buckeye Cookery and Practical Housekeeping, Estelle Woods Wilcox Fried beefsteak and Fried veal cutlets 1879--Housekeeping in Old Virginia, Marion Cabell Tyree ---Beefsteak fried with onions (p. 143); Fried steak (p. 144) The oldest recipe we have on file for chicken fried steak is this one dated 1949: Chicken-Fried Steak One round steak, cut 3/4 inch thick. Rub with salt and pepper. Pound all the flour possible into the steak. Sear on both sides in hot cooking fat. Cook until browned." ---Household Searchlight Recipe Book, Topeka Kansas [1949 edition] (p. 192)

*blush* in re response number 29, the url needs the www... http://www.southerfoodways.com/

*sigh* it also needs to be spelled correctly... http://www.southernfoodways.com/

I had the chicken fried chicken at the 290 Cafe and it was very good. I guess this place is still happening. We stopped to eat there on the way to Hot Springs Arkansas as part of Bob and Karen's moving caravan.

i often wondered why it was called chicken fried steak and never put together the fact that it was breaded the same way as fried chicken *duh*

(It is good comforting to me to see someone else making the mistypes!!) We ride around in a pickup truck which has NEVER been washed. We fit right in at the CFS stops. I guess I'd better try a taste (despite my blood thinners, cholesterol banishers and stern looks from my MD) before I make any other comments. Thanks. I had no idea it was a national treasure. I though chili of one sort or another (bbq?) was Texas' national dish.

Barbecue.

Do you eat slaw with it as the North Carolinians do? They have whole places devoted to the pursuit of the perfect 'cue here

they have barbecue spas in NYC! *LAUGH* i about died when i watched that on food network (they slather you with BBQ sauce and then heat you up afterwards)

Well, hmmm...

and it wasn't cheap, let me tell you! don't remember what this lady forked over but it was at an upscale hotel, afterwards, she got to hang out by the pool and somebody brought her a big ol texas sized BBQ sandwich with all the fixin's.

Do you get to choose who dines off of you when you are heated thru. The possibilities pixillate the imagination.

no, you aren't the buffet table though the dude slathering this girl up sure looked like he wanted to pick up a plate!

i was grossed out just watchin' him brush the stuff on her--like i walked in on somebody!

Man y'all are makin' me hongry and it ain't even dinner time.

Get a room comes to mind. Intimate dining experience takes on whole new meaning !

Is Possum considered "game" ?

Depends on where you live, I think, but probably.

I heard extracurricularly that possum was VERMIN, but go figure tastes might vary from diner to diner.

Final answer? Possum is edible or not?

hell... just about anything is edible... the real question is... does it taste yummy?!?!

Good point. What do you think of when you think Southern food? okra chicken fried steak what else?

taters... grease... butter and honey on biscuits... sweeeeeeeeeeeet tea

sweet iced teas mashed potatoes green beans grits

No one said cornbread when asked what came to mind in re Southern food...hmmm...

collard greens.