Where do desires come from? Sometimes desires are mimetic. That means that they are adopted by imitating the desires of others. Sometimes desires arise from deep-seated fears. For every deep-seated fear, there is a corresponding desire to be free from the grip of that fear. That desire can manifest itself as a desire for relief, for comfort or security, for some compensation or palliative, for achieving some elusive goal. One of the better ways to get rid of unwanted desires is to uncover the source of the desire. Do you want to do that?

I gather we are back to introspection as we are for all emotional needs we cannot put aside - as in forgiveness. Are not desires different from Needs on a very basic level? Desires are things we want but there is not a grinding need for them in our lives. Needs are so basic to our lives that without them, part of us is missing. It is fairly easy to get rid of unwanted desires, but those needs which reside in the core of our being are not so easily dispensed with.

We often make a distinction between needs and wants, in the sense that needs are indispensable whereas wants are amenities that are not required for survival. But in most cases, people don't agree on the boundary between wants and needs. And so we use the term "desires" to cover both cases. I clench my teeth, so I evidently have a "grinding need" for whatever missing thing in my life is causing me to clench them. But I know that I could very well live to an old age never learning or discovering the missing element that would bring my teeth clenching to a resolution. Do I need the solution? I surely want it, surely desire it. But do I need it? Will I die without it? Will I die because I lack it?

I'm not sure any response I give would be helpful... You see, I spend a good part of my life pursuing what I want... (probably because I don't draw that line well either Barry...) and often my pursuits have resulted in dismal failure BUT I couldn't stop (wouldn't stop) until I'd reached the end. Either success or failure or some other sort of resolution (like I got halfway there and realized my 'want' had waned...) Perhaps that sounds destructive to you? Perhaps it is. I suppose I could clarify and explain that material wants are not an issue usually and I can 'forget' those... don't know how... they just are cursory wants I guess... But my emotional and mental and spiritual wants... I see no need to supress those. After all... I believe I will only live once and I would like to live happily in pursuit of everything that may lead to that end. I certainly am an emotional extremist. Usually VERY happy but when I come down, it's hard and I am pretty darn miserable... Passion doesn't come in gray (IMHO) and when I want passionately I cannot (or will not) turn it off. I apologize WER, I realize that you may have asked that question for a legitimite answer and I have given you the antithesis of that... (and Barry... in response to your 'will I die?' post... if you want passionately enough something may become a need... and, yes, it is possible to die from extreme want... Have you never heard of lovesickness?... The saddest sight is watching someone want something with no visible path to success... wanting the return of a deceased spouse comes to mind... and perhaps... by wanting too much (or just enough?)... they die)

Stacey, you gave words to the very idea which has been hammering at me for months, and that is the want that becomes so desperate that it becomes a need in the very most basic sense of the word. Attaining that fulfillment may be self-destructive, but one is driven to pursue it because the need is so relentless.

Jakob Bronowski said of our species, "If we are any kind of machine at all, we are learning machines." Our need to learn is one of those desires that may own us. A gap in knowledge can be rilly rilly stubborn. It just wants to be filled. And so we can have a passion, an obsession, driven by a need to know, a need to find out, a need to discover. Mebbe that's why I'm a researcher. I need to know where that need to know comes from. :)

I knew there was a reason I was a researcher...that just has to be it, Barry. I need to know thy I need to know things. I am still perplexed about when what you want (need, actually) is not yours and cannot be yours. How do you change that?

I also need to know how to proof read my posts...that was I need to know why...

am trying to read all the posts and at the same time wanting to comment. i'm like stacey in that i don't want material things. well, unless you count wanting to have a farm and lots of animals material, which, it may be. what i want and what i need become the same only when the emotional response is so strong that it easily becomes one and the same and is indestinguishable to me. all people have basic needs (and shall i say all beings) and those needs must be met. a lot of what i want and what i need can be the same. someone who needs love may say i want love, i want a hug, when they mean they need a hug, they need love. i have realized that my wants aren't necessarily what is good for me to have. something can appear to be the answer to the want but in reality it is not. can i change what i want? yes. but that depends on circumstances. does what someone else want become what i want? not necessarily so. it depends on the type of want it is, if you follow me. is it emotional, physical, material, selfish, etc? get so tired of wondering if i'm happy or not. because i can think of a million things why i'm not and then can think of a million things why i am. my wants or so idealized that it's not possible to even happen. i have wants that are impossible and probably unappropriate because as i grow i learn more about what i want and need.

marcia, i have a desire to know things too....and how come i never get my way?

My almost insatiable want to know things sometimes becomes misinterpreted as a need to always be right and often keeps others I care about from caring about me. Maybe I need to change my wants, too, but to what? To be more lovable? Does one need to compromise to be loved?

No changes, John; you have just been hanging around the wrong people. You do not need to compromise anything to be lovable. I know this...trust me. Because the intellectually sluggish resent anyone making them look less that curious, their only option other than actually putting forth the effort to learn something is to put you down. I know that...and it no longer works with me. Wolf, you never get your way...if I only knew!!! Me too. I am the last to be considered...

*hugs* john, marcia is right. if people don't care for you as you are, don't waste your time. unless, of course, the things that are you are dangerous to your safety and the safety of others. i'm saying, john, put the axe down, easy now! *hugs*

Wolf, your intuitive vision is excellent--fortunately, my name is not Raskalnikov [sic?]...my axe is made of hollow plastic!

And thanks for the vote of confidence, Marcia...even if among those who know me you happen to be a minority of one!

Research is what I do when I don't know what I'm doing. I do a lot of research. Marcia, think of a partially assembled jigsaw puzzle with some tantalizing holes in it, some missing pieces. We need, we want, we desire those missing pieces. The jigsaw puzzle is a map of the territory. Those gaps in the maps are like a hole in the soul. We want to know our world so that we can navigate it from one end to the other. Why? Because at one end of the territory is hellmouth, and at the other end is heavensgate, or so we believe. And we feel the need to be able to break on through to the other side. We need a path and a jump-start for when we get stuck.

Thank, Barry. The puzzle allegory is excellent. However, as soon as I fill in the tantalizing missing parts, I long for another puzzle, so I hunt one down. I also do a lot of research and puzzling (actually, I love doing jigsaw puzzles!)It is as though I am driven by the "thrill" of the hunt, rather than its success. When I am through with the puzzle, it no longer interests me.

typical gemini trait if you ask me!

This is true...*grin*

There is but one jigsaw puzzle. The giant jigsaw puzzle of universal knowledge. And you will never run out of holes, gaps, chasms, or frontiers.

gimme that edge piece over there please... ahhh! and a corner piece... NOW this is beginning to make some sense!

What's really fun is to compare partially assembled jigsaw puzzles with each other. Cuz we're all putting together maps of the same territory. The common frontiers are very romantic. Osculating frontiers. There are two kinds of osculating frontiers. Can you envision what they are? Hint: Look up osculating circles in geometry.

Take it from me, you can really get knocked for a loop when you bump osculating frontiers with somebody.

I understand completely...no matter how we intellectualize these things, it happens.

(Was I intellectualizing again? Pass me the Ivory soap & I'll wash it out.)

Leave it alone... Cleanliness is next to Godliness, and I am not sure we could stand too much more Godliness in here...*grin*

Oh good. I'm in the right place then. ;)

Amen, sister!

I just wanna know... What is in that 56/100 % impurity, anyway?

The air they beat into it so it will float? Residual lye? Is it not necessary to print all ingredients on packages...? Hmmmmm.....

fragrance and fluff (sawdust? rat guts?) oops... wrong topic!

*LOL*

and we are back to desiring what we can't have .....

Always a dangerous position...