Wisdom...What is it?

Wisdom: a way of seeing ourselves and our world that ... hmmm let me think some more about that.

wisdom is not easy to define. perhaps it cannot be defined at all. Lao Tsu is said to have written: "The tao (way) that can be told is not the enternal Tao (Way). The name that can be named is not the eternal Name...."

Hmmm... Afraid I must hold with Waldo: "The wise- through excess of wisdom- are made fools." (or something like that) And- along the lines of another thought Waldo held- if consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, might Wisdom be described as that of the intellectually myopic? What I mean is, are men even capable of recognising genuine wisdom, or truth, much less holding it? The older I become, the more such things seem to be ignis fatuus...

The older I get, the less I seem to know. Socrates -- for all his faults -- started out believing that the only wisdom he really had was "knowing that he did not know." Plato even suggested that people where not even ready to "do" philosophy until they past the age of 40. It does take a little while to realize how little we know. So what is the value of such consideration in the first place?

I found Hermann Hesse's Siddhartha's words interesting when he said wisdom is not communicable. The wisdom which a wise man tries to communicate always sound foolish; knowledge can be communicated but not wisdom.

Perhaps, it is like being a young child who cannot talk, but can point with its finger at something. Only with wisdom, that which is being pointed at has no specific words that "say it." What is the sound of one hand clapping?????????? P.S. I love Hermann Hesse's Siddhartha.

I look forward to rereading it someday.

Wisdom is knowing enough to abstaing when you know you really have no idea what is the question, nevermind the answer.

So, perhaps, _not-doing_ is an aspect of wisdom.?.?

Knowing when to and when not to.

This "knowing" must be a different kind of knowing from the kind of knowing that we have, say, of when someone is in this room?.. yes...no?

Is there someone in this room? (just wondering)

That would depend upon how you believe.

To paraphrase David St. Hubbins, I believe, basically everything I read (it makes me a wiser, more aware and discerning person than one that believes in nothing, or only some. Of what he reads, I mean)...

Often I believe what others say is their own truth, not necessarily mine -- does that count as believing or not, IYO?

I see that we are starting to come to the question of "truth" -- I think I will open a topic for that, now.

Wisdom: Knowledged gained through experience. And the definition doesn't discount those who are "wise beyond their years." Often one may take another's experience and garner knowledge from it leading to furthering his own wisdom.

Yes. Yes. Actually, I somethings think that some of my children were just born wise. Then, later, they "forget" their wisdom.

Did they actually forget, or just misapply their new knowledge?

Well, I don't think they had any knowledge yet. Perhaps, the wisdom they had got covered up with knowledge. I sometime say, that we must forget our "knowledge" in order to get back our wisdom. Wisdom is a higher order of integration than knowledge. By the time we have "knowledge" we are already broken into fragments. (Man...Am I making any sense any longer????)

Who is willing to spout their 'thoughts on wisdom' when those thoughts are not so popular? How much do we miss out on when our own minds will not even consider big changes? Why couldn't the contemporaries of Leonardo listen and learn, and where would we be now if they (we) had listened? What is it we fear about big changes? Perhaps we do not want to let go of what we feel secure in. Maybe that is why humanities social structure changes sooooo slowly.

Well....Steven....I think the answer to your question is that it seems that most "big changes" just lead to choas. And, choas is not a pleasant thing. One needs peace of mind, rest. Resistance to change may just be an expression of the desire for peace of mind and rest. Change, by itself, is not a good thing.

"wisdom is age, there are no old fools"

sometimes i hear that it is difficult to tell a wise person from a fool. sometimes the most foolish thing we could do might just really be the wisest thing in the end.

Someone was hung on a cross for just that.

Yep.

Americ said; And, choas is not a pleasant thing. One needs peace of mind, rest. People can change real fast when everything is changing in the right direction (relative). It can even be chaotic and they don't mind.... Its the fear of quick change in the negative direction that makes us such scaredy cats. (How do you spell that anyway?). Its sort of like having to let go of everything again, to get ready for the next event. Maybe we are afraid of letting go of that 'old stuff' again.

We, as a, so called "civilized society", live in fear of changes. Fear is a insecurity one has with oneself. So therefor we conform. Conformity can be good, but most of the time it works against a person. No longer does he or she act on implulse. A wise man or woman acts with truth and harmony to others. They will be rejected by people. But that comes with the territory.

Yeshe What happens when your truth is not someone else's harmony? Do you still express? Or do you hold your truth in judgement as non-expressible?

Complete truth in time shall be expressed in fullness... If that makes any sense?????

Yeshe, I understand what you said. How long are you going to wait? Seems like if you wait long enough, it will never happen. I don't mean to rush you though.

Steven -- Waiting/not-waiting. Not-doing/doing. Not always clear what the difference is. If one pushes too hard -- the universe sometimes comes back and just pushes back. Sometimes, doing-nothing, waiting, does everything in the fullness of time.

100% agreement on that Americ. But when the time is right... do we always speak/do? That is our/your dilemna? Harmony between you and the rest of yourself. When the soul speaks/does,.. so does Americ. And when the soul is quiet, Americ just relaxes. My views, The only way I know to get better and better at that is by staying in the heart, and out of the head (old paradigms there). Then letting go of fears. So when the soul wants to play a part, I don't dismiss it as an 'inappropriate thought'. Sometimes, ego created laws, rules, ethics, morals etc.. Created for the purpose of keeping our fears out of sight (ineffectively), get in the way of doing/speaking. It's difficult to find your fears, when the 'utopian world' won't show them to you. Well engineered personal and global armegeddons seem to work well.

Well said, Steven.

Staying in your heart, as you put it, and out of your head to improve yourself and to let go of fear, seems to be a paradox. What is the heart? I assume you are using the heart to describe gut feelings, emotions, and instinct. Fear is an intregal part of these things and thus your heart, are they not? It would seem easier to use your emotionless head to lead you in rational decisions than your heart. What about anger in the heart? Anger is apart from fear and is from your heart. Without the guidence of the "head" or intellect what is to stop you, or ME, from killing someone? Have you never had a fit of rage so violent murder seemed to be a viable option? I have. But it was my intellect which prevented this while my whole heart wanted nothing but blood. So is it trully best to listen to the heart and ignore the head? By guiding my behavior with laws and ethics I am neither ignoring my emotions or masking my fear. My intellect can pursue my emotions without action (such as murder) and only in thought, safely (for other humans). So if a world of lawlessness lead by the heart is what you seek, lets bring on the anarchy and divulge in the bloodfest, perhaps you will obstain from it, but I surely will not. Personally, I vote for "head" ethics. --I'm new here, hello everyone. Jon

Hello Jon, and welcome to our little philosophy corner! I think there is a semantic problem? The 'Heart' as some use it is really just a focal point. It is also called by some "the center'. The place is just behind the breastbone. If you will feel in that area (not visualize), you will pull your 'awareness' out of your head. When successful, and it does take practice, you won't now what is going on in your head, because you won't be there. ( After a time, you might here a voice, or see a picture from that place. It is sometimes called the phone jack of the soul. Though techies give it a URL. Need more info?

About the rage so bad to violently murder, yes, but only towards myself. It is my "heart" that always stops me, because of what I would make others feel, not because of what they would think.

wer, you're starting to worry me... are you okay?

That is another very loaded question, nick. Right now, the alcohol and "medicine" is kicking in, so mellow is starting to rule. What's you're favorite form of catharsis, nick?

that's a loaded question, too... usually begins with a lady... catharsis can be a tricky thing, though... must be able to accept it as it is...

just listening...

Nope, you're here, join in.

by all means...

not feeling exceptionally wise today actually. But I am feeling good: in control, and headed in positive directions. Sometimes its not what you know or who you know... its when you know.

today...i am feeling under the whether.... so i don't think.

hope you feel better soon. I know the weather here is pretty durn low. Snow, snow, and more snow with no sunshine (a rarity for Colorado)

Americ Sometimes big changes in life require the body to shut down a little. Could be its just change.

think that wisdom comes into play when one knows when to follow the heart and when to follow the head.

hmmm... there are other imperatives, you know... (and sometimes wisdom is no more than recoginizing one's own fallability) (and knowing, too, when it's time to get the hell out of Dodge...nowhutimean?)

isn't that what i said? but, haven't lived as long as you =O

nor are you likely to, my sweet...

Yikes!

Wisdom is when the heart and the mind are in complete harmony with one another.

Yes...Yeshe...I agree with you When my mind and heart are in complete harmony That seems to be wisdom for me these days This is what I have always wanted the most all my life

Don't think it can be labeled, It is much more than wisdom isn't it?

Yes. No words for it.

Sort of tells us that the really interesting aspects of life have been experienced so rarely, that no words have been put to them yet. At least not in our culture. Maybe new ideas,words and dissapearing concepts of duality will change our language,

Maybe we need to keep on creating new languages as our experiences get deeper. That has been one of my interests in Sanskrit over the years. It has a powerful set of words for states of mind/spirit.

give us a sample

om tat sat Could mean: "you are that" or "I am that" or "God is THAT." or "This is it." We could spend days on this one.. We could even create a topic around it.

Could mean all of the above in an integrated sense.

Yes. I think you are on the money, Steve. (and ... Steve, ...is that Octagon spa still out there in Rimrock?)

It is as eternal as experience itself. But, still isn't hooked up. bummer huh. We have more complaints about that....

Sorry to here that. Perhaps, we did fail, and I include myself, to built true community. It requires far more wisdom than I have to help make that happen. IT seems like grace to me when it happens.

Wisdom, I like how Athena was born from Zeus's head whole and complete thereby signifying age and a wealth of knowledge. But I also like the idea of the fear of God in the hebrew texts being the beginning of wisdom, the awe in the omniscince of a God, for ever, I think meditation is therefore a key to wisdom, such as what philosphy means love of wisdom and philosophy takes part in discourses.

Yes...I find most of my own wisdom these days in lots of quiet time. And, I find myself saying less and less as time goes on. "Be still and know..." it is written.

When you are still and know you can observe everything as it really is, true reality. Knowing what true reality is and seeing it, brings wisdom. AT MOMENTS!!!!!!!!!!!

the very idea of being acquainted with any "true reality" is frightening as hell...

Nice to see ya back, Yeshe! Even if for just a "moment"!

Why thank you, you are very kind !!! Reality is very scary. But we must face it in oder to accomplish the things that we dream and hope for in life. It can be frightening at times and at other times it is wonderful.

as often as i've said- and others, too- "poetry is truth"- (and it ought to be)- what truth can any man know? images of life, filtered through prejudice and expectation; musings of death- colored by fear (and very practical implications). and love- is (even) love a truth? can it ever really be? it is not a proveable thing- a plaintive sigh, a catch of breath- ephemeral, at best... but that is the thing- the crux of it, well proved- every thing a man holds true vanishes, in the end as it had never been... (i think that's reality)

Ahh, trancience, the major theme of every novel of import, according to my 12th grade English teacher!

Do you think she was right?

Of course, but does it really matter?

What does matter?

In what context?

Nick that is a beatiful poem. And I agree poerty can say so much with such little words. And a comment about the end of the poem that everything true to man vanishes, this is quite true. LIfe works in cycles. What may be true to you today may be just a false thought tomorrow.

the thing is, though, that's all you can really count on... you can fill your life with whatever you wish, love whatever, whomever you wish, attempt to achieve the same- and all you can really count on is that you can't count on anything, for very long, before it dies... and i'm not saying that necessarily detracts from everything else- and there is much, of course- it's just that it colors everything, enough, as it is...

Nick, this is off the topic, but why do your posts always read as short little sentences?

hmmm.. not sure what you mean, autumn... you sure about that? (lol!) (i dunno... maybe it's like a diminished-capacity kind of thing...)

OK you little smart-ass computer geek, I'll figure it out myself! (eventually)

He got used to talking to Wolf. She posts like she's in a chat room, and Nick picked that up to keep up with her. It's easier to read and scroll through lots of responses, also. Or not...

I have been spending more time in silance since the holidays. A great thing to "do". We get flashes of our true nature below the surface of all the passing things.

The true essence of one's soul will always be the same.

If the 'true essence' will always be the same... do you believe in fate? destiny? that an individual (or his soul) can be 'bad' as opposed to good?

*dodging question*

*throwing question out again*

*still dodging* Hiya, sweetie, we're on at the same time!!!

damn, I guess I just missed you last week. Howya been?

odd

I do believe in fate and destiny. No soul is born evil. But we are humans not saints. We must over come fate to accomplish our destiny.

overcome fate to accomplish our destiny... Sheesh! Yeshe, that's pretty heavy.

Ain't it though. There is no way in avoiding our fate. It happens and we get over it. What ever it may be. We benefit from our suffering.

the old "what doesn't kill us makes us stronger" approach? I believe that's different from overcoming fate but a difficult proposition in its own right.

i guess that is true, and beautiful in it's way (the "high and solitary and most stern" beauty attached to things we cannot change)... but it really really sucks...

*smile*

Life is beautiful.

Life is awesome, too.

miraculous! (ok, got my two cents in *giggle*)

The thing is that we keep "forgetting" the wonder of existence and awareness over and over again. So we constantly need to remember.

don't mean to sound arbitrary, but that is wholly a matter of perspective... owing entirely to our lack of understanding... what i'm saying is, isn't "wonder" an inevitable casualty of introspection? doesn't it kind of wear off, as we become inured to what we (believe we) understand? (maybe it's just me, but i rarely feel that anymore)

nick, I would agree that "the wonder of existence" is purely a matter of perspective and a phrase often used to conjure up emotions of 'not understanding' so we may sit back in wonderment on the same note, different tone... I spent the day hiking alone off Mt. Falcon with a borrowed camera. We received several inches of snow last night but the sun was bright and the wind calm. As is often the case, I soon forgot about picture taking and wandered off into my own little existence... and was grateful if not amazed. *centered smile*

Yes, Stacey, I believe an indiviual/soul can be all good, all bad, or anywhere between.

the soul is the bottom line, it's what we do with the messages it tells us. but as for wisdom? don't know where mine went, lost it today......

"Went into the bar at 3 am, seeking solace in a bottle, or possibly a friend..."

"...what help is here? there is no help, and all these things are so: and all the world is bitter as a tear. And how these things are, though ye strove to show- she would not know..." (swinburne) (i dunno, it just popped in my head)

"I wake up in the morning and I step outside, and I take a deap breath and I get real high, and I scream from the top of my lungs, 'What's going on?'" Four non blondes, the other was Indigo girls (i dunno either, same thing, *POP*) have I driven everyone off with the melacholy, Nick? figured everyone would be used to it by now...

no, we're just worried about you... lately, it's just seemed a little deeper, maybe, than melancholia... just wanta be sure you're okay...

here's the general formula for me... no sleep plus no food equals depression, depression plus time to think equals state of assholiness, I've gotten used to saying whatever on here and it is hard to remember sometimes that I shouldn't do that, apologies around, just ignore me next time 'cause it is not crying for help, or attention, just looking for some sort of focus and trying to let some of the demons out as I can only handle a few at a time...I really am sorry everyone

you all are safe, and my largest collection of friends, being an ass here doesn't screw up going home or make work worse...I know I've said before that I'm not a social creature (asocial and antisocial I've got down though), and a lot of times when I'm being really crappy there is usually some person that I want to talk to the most, and when circumstances are such that I can't, things go even further downhill, I'm very analytical and shoot for the worst possible scenario so that hopefully I won't be surprised at how bad I've screwed things up between us, thus self-fulfilling my own destructive prophesies... I try sometimes to issue warnings about how screwed up my thought process is, but lately it has hit me that I'm just trying to avoid responsibility for my particular sociopathy, did, however, get back on the vitamins yesterday, and I think that the two Shiners didn't hurt either... *smile*

ah... the Indigo girls. glad you're on the road to typical abnormalcy, WER! Lemme know when you need that Rocky Mountain High...

thanks, Stace... *wink*

Think we all get a bit like that wer. Especially when we think things aren't going the right way (at least what we would like to see). Since I'm a leaper, let me offer this, always wear a parachute! *wink* Don't jump until you know all the particulars (like wind, elevation, landing site, and when to pull the cord).......

good advice however, I tend to respond more rashly. at least I'm not prone to leaping out of high flying situations. Mine is more of a get in the car and see how many state lines you can cross before you have to stop for another Big Gulp

well, wer, if you try stacey's way, wear a seatbelt, have plenty of gas, and plenty of bills (NTM, rest areas!) (Stacey, i don't mean literally leap-can't figure out why folks wanna jump from perfectly good airplanes)

Can't imagine wanting to bring that kind of chaos into your life....

Have had those urges to get in the car and go. Thank goodness my job sends me to school twice a year. Love the drive (not being in the car that long) just being able to drive and stop when I want, listen to what I want, have the windows all rolled down and singing at the top of my lungs!!

What kind of work do you do? What kind of training do they send you to--and where?

(chaos is what's real though, don't you think? everything else a carefully manipulated illusion... perhaps the thing to do is learn to, i dunno, appreciate it... like, go with it... or don't... i dunno...)

government contracting, Autumn. Since the field is constantly changing, I go to classes on a regular basis. March will be Norfolk Virginia. hi nick

hi... what's doin'?

nut'in honey.....you?

uhhh... i be chillin'... (velvet underground..."jesus")

i be's sleepy. changed some stuff at my site, go and check it out, y'all.....

Chaos Rules! Long live Entropy! (Next time you go, Stacey, drive by and pick me up...)

almost left last night and, from previous experience, when things get THAT bad they either get much better or I leave. we're working on much better this morning. I took your advice (general comment) nick, and let it all out. Nothing saved, nothing reserved, this is how I feel. And oh my...

(sigh... i hope that's good)

yeah... kinda like scrubbing the gravel out of a road rash wound... gotta be done and you'll feel better for it in... (a couple of weeks?)

excellent analogy... to be willing to endure that scrubbing is indicative of love, or high character (or both)... either of which elicit envy, 'cause i've not yet been willing/able/ whatever to sit through it... couple of weeks seems a small price to pay, i guess (though that's easy to say... the gravel's not imbedded in me)... godspeed to you, ms vura... hope you come out of the other side of this thing soon...)

hi

(you say that now...)

(yeah, what're you hiding behind your back?)

(everything i can)

heehee

thanks nick. for the kind words and kind thoughts.

(any time)

HI! My name is Ri�tte - I've only been going in to the Bront� conference, but I enjoy outrageous philosophical talk, so here's my opinion on wisdom: It can simply not exist. I think wisdom has a great deal to do with honesty with oneself, and this honesty is a very inconsistent character trait in even the best of people. Wisdom must therefore be an illusion, created by those who speak great words, and seem authorotative, who drown their ignorance in impressive words and gestures, thereby having their ignorance seem wise judgement to others. Honesty can exist some of the time if we accept the challenge it presents, but wisdom is beyond our human capabilities.

i like the view that wisdom has a great deal to do with honesty with oneself but i disagree about it being a very inconsistent character trait. it is a character trait that one must work hard to strive for but it is aattainable. perhaps striving for that trait has something to do with becoming a wise person.

in some circles, Riette, your pronouncement on wisdom above would itself be considered wise...

My first response is to Ray: Ray, are you honest with yourself all the time? If you are, I hereby declare that you must be an angel or some other kind of unwordly creature. I too strive for honesty, and though I am honest with others - because I dread my being found false and perfidious by others, I am far too human to be honest with myself all the time. Therefore I posess no wisdom.

TO Wer: If you happen to be one of those who might consider my pronouncement on wisdom wise, then I am sure that all I have written, and all you have written in response is merely a fragment of your imagination . . .

no, i'm not honest with myself all the time. but, i try, and i think about it all the time, and i think i know most of the times when i am *not* being honest with myself. the contemplative life is the wise life.

inre #142: that's as valid a belief as any other... now if I could just get everyone who believes that I exist to stop, I might get caught up on my sleep...

You guys have to stop 'coming' two at a time . . . you flatter me, and I don't like flattery - there's another topic for discussion; I shall go open it. Anyway, Ray, I admire you your contemplative life, but it merely proves you to be a good and virtuous person, not neccessarily wise. A question: Are you honest because you enjoy it (which is essentially against our human nature) or because you want to plant your mind above injuries? Be honest with yourself now . . . WER, some persons, when something is beyond their reach will present the matter in an impertinent or curious light, and so would have their ignorance seem wise judgement . . .

I am wise enough to know that there are times when it does not behoove me to be honest with myself.

excellent point...

You mean you are sensible enough . . .

What is wise and what is sensible is often the same, no?

Uh-Uh. What is sensible and rational is often the same. There is no such thing as wisdom, remember?

Oh, that's your reality....or doesn't that exist, either?

SURE it does - but I'm not wise enough to prove it. How do you define wisdom, Autumn? Great thoughts, great words/deeds?

Following my intuition.

Sounds good . . . in theory. I can more or less believe that following their intuition can work for some people - and you sound a sensible one. Frankly, my intuition frightens me! I tend to rely on what the head says - and even that turns out to be a disasterous decision at times!

Wow--you can't rely on your reason or your intuition? Bummer!

Nope. I try to rely on reason most of the time, but often emotions get in the way. And if I think, ah, perhaps I should now rely on my intuition, the warning signals start flickering in my head, and I switch to auto-pilot - reasoning. I suppose that is why wisdom cannot exist for me - I mean, if one can't even decide when to follow the heart or when to follow the head, then one cannot possiply be wise. Do you always, always rely on your intiution, Autumn? How do you manage it - I mean, how do you know it is 'right'? Or am I too obsessed with what is right and what is wrong?

I think I must be a naturally intuitive person and am very atune to auras. I cannot explain the process of knowing what to embrace and what to avoid.

And so what are the rest of us supposed to do? How do we know when to follow the heart or when to follow the head? How can the mind know when to follow the heart or when to follow itself? I mean, if the mind follows the heart, does this not mean the mind denying itself? And how can the heart follow the mind without abandoning feeling?

compromise.

You mean doing things halfheartedly and with half a mind??

At the same time?

no. not at all. do you and Mr. C often agree on everything to the same extent? Do you ever have to bend in one area to be compensated in another. Sometimes you have to use your head to know that it is time to think with your heart. Sometimes, you have to use your heart to really figure out what the result will have on your head. They are too interrelated (in me anyway) to separate fully. I do tend to think with my heart but my head knows that this is my tendency and can step in when disaster strikes.

I like the way you put that, Stacey.

Yes, perhaps that's where my problem lies - I tend to draw a clear, straight line between the two, THEREBY denying the one or the other. And therefore often make the wrong decisions. Can't believe I was unable to figure that out for myself - moron! Thanks, Stacey!

Your welcome Riette, I think. (glad you're back)

Yeah, me too - just feel sorry for the rest of you.

why would that be, Riette?

Oh, I don't have to explain, do I, Wer?

nope

is it wisdom or intuition, or something completely different, that helps us interact with those we care for most? (for if it is either, I am surely lacking)

Why do you say that, Stacey? You seem to interact with people just fine - or have storm clouds gathered over the Vura-household again? I don't think wisdom plays ANY role in relationships - if it did we'd be sitting in a pit of desperation ALL the time, not just some of the time. I think it must be the very fact that we care that helps us interact - but don't take advice from me please, I'm a real bummer at interacting at the moment, as I think you might have noticed . . .

an honest question... and perhaps a storm or two brewing...

Well, it happens. Sometimes it just has to. But I'm still sorry to hear that.

Riette, wisdom plays an important role in any relationship. You have a lot of wisdom. It might be easier for you to understand this, if I give you another name for wisdom: "Common Sense". When a person's time comes they have to die! There, THAT is the only thing that HAS to happen. Everything else is changeable.

Do you think that it is because everything is so changeable that one is never satisfied with anything?

YES!!! The grass is always greener. By the way the grass is greener works on cattle. If you want them to eat something that they don't particularly like, put it just outside the fence. they will eat it all.

That is also the best way to ride a donkey. You bind some carrots on a stick, get onto its back, and hold the stick so that the carrots dangle in front of it's nose, but just out of reach. Then you just point the stick to where you want to go, and off you go! It really really works!

Unless the donkey gets mad at you. and decides to get you off his back.

That's what happened with my donkey.

He only threw you off, because you gave him cooked carrots, Jim!

After he threw me off, he came over to me and put his 2 hind hoofs on my chest and started pressing down, so it was hard for me to get these words out, "Now I feel like a cooked carrot." He pooped on me. My face didn't like that. But he left me alone and walked off and away towards Hawaii or North Korea or Netscape.

Well, may he get blown up by a volcano for doing that! You shouldn't let donkeys DO that to you, Jim. Next time you have to be ready for him! The question is: what will you use for amunition? Remember, this is poop you're up against!

down against. wish I coulda gotten up. donkeys sure can put alotta oomph weight on their hind legs. and boy do they move fast when they gotta take a poop. I am glad I didn't have my big fat mouth open at the time.

Eugh! What a picture. Kick the damn donkey's ar$e! That'll teach him!

or get you knee deep in more $hit...

Better watch it, Riette, Donkeys kick back.

I'd rather be kicked that $hite upon!

I mean: I'd rather be kicked THAN $hat upon!

What about being kicked into the manure, Riette?

Nope, that would not appeal. I'll make sure I'm facing a chocolate fountain.

Riette, just make sure that it is the right kind of chocolate.

As long as it's sweet, I don't care about right or wrong.

Ok Riette! let me rephrase that. Make sure that what looks like chocolate, IS.

Well, I'd HAVE to taste it one way or the other - I'll let myself be surprised!

UGH!! What a surprise, Riette!

As long as it's a surprise! Won't go for something rough textured - one musn't go LOOKING for $hit! So to speak....

Good point, Riette, It pays to have a positive attitude.

ha-ha! What now? Do you have any philosophy regarding wisdom? Or does wisdom lie in the experimenting with foolish things?

WoW what Insight Riette. I do have a belief about wisdom, that it's common sense and the second half of your answer would also apply.

That despite knowing it's wrong one should try it anyway, just to be sure?

Riette, the only thing that is guaranteed not to work, is something that was not tried. sometimes the most ridiculous things work.

I like that! Next time somebody calls me impulsive, I'll assume he means wise!

Well, Riette, you know what they say about assume!!

What do they say about assume? You assumed it was a fart, but it turned out solid?

Riette, Look!! Assume= ASS U ME

I don't DO that, Tim!!! I'll never assume anything ever again if you're going to put it THAT way! I've learned my lesson!

Riette, I was only kidding with you. But that is what they say.

I know! But how true! That's the frightening bit!

Well, Riette, I've had it thrown in my face a couple of times.