...and as I meant to end my last post: We will agree to disagree. I like going *out* to the movies. Nothing can replace the experience of seeing performances on a big screen. The poor Empire review of Relative Values is online: http://www.empireonline.co.uk/reviews/review.asp?id=5912&ss=relative+values&sb=t&or=bf&c=&r=0&f=0&cp=1

There is a review of MLSF in the Monday Canberra Times. Am assuming that it is now out on video in Australia (says "available now" by Roadshow). This would be PAL version if people wanted to purchase.

Have been away from the computer for awhile, but have finally caught up (with this topic, at least). Lots of interesting discussion...lots of differing viewpoints. First let me say congrats to all faithful fans of SD and JE--how proud you must be. I was pleasantly surprised at TRT's clean-up at the Tonys last night. Like Evelyn, I'd love, love, love to see CF on B'way earning like praise for his abilities (with or without awards--preferably with, of course). I've always maintained that Livia would love it here; besides, LA's only a five hour flight and a three hour time difference. ;-) Regarding the discussion about CF's career view: (Anne) I do not believe he is interested. He works to live, to have a nice home, a happy marriage and to pursue what he believes in - in doing good where he can. I think we have to face the fact he will never be a 'star' in the Hollywood sense - I truly believe he is not interested. I used to believe this, based on quotes I have read in the past. However, as Karen points out, this latest batch of remarks has shed new light on the subject. Sure, he's still ambivalent about being a star (i.e., it's clear he's not after stardom for stardom's sake), but his recent comments reveal (IMO) a more aggressive and less passive approach to his career. Regarding the latest rumored project: I agree with Karen here (never realized that Matt Damon and Tony Blair have similar ears :-P). I'll belive it when I see it, especially Kevin Spacey's involvement. Bethan has made a good point--TV roles are weighted differently in the UK than in the US. I'd much rather see CF in a film or theater role, but I'd be OK with TV as long as it was a high profile, high publicity project (albeit in the UK alone, not globally). I'm happy with anything he does as long as it's better than his performance in SLOW, which I found below his usual standard, and as long as he stays far away from the likes of Big Daddy (DH had this on over the weekend. Utter 'video toilet paper' but it made a ton of $$$). I hope RV finds a US distributor; I'm looking forward to seeing CF's performance and would love to see it on the big screen. Enjoy the premiere, Ann!

I find the attitude that US standards of life and work are the benchmark by which all actors' lives and careers are to be measured to be provincial and condescending. And I am pretty sure that's how Colin Firth would view them too. The majority British actors have always moved among the multiple media with regularity. They go where the work is, they hone a variety of skills, and are better for it. If they want to do Hollywood films exclusively, they piss off for California (e.g. Tim Roth, Gary Oldman, Anthony Hopkins) and have done with it. An actor in Britain is considered successful if he/she is making a living at his/her chosen craft doing projects of which he/she is not ashamed. That means doing television, radio, concert narration, audiotape recording, theatre, and film. Apparently an actor in America is only considered to be successful if he has made financially successful films and the cover of People magazine. God forbid he should do television. But then since so much American television is total crap, he'd have a hard time being proud of such a job. And since intelligent American radio is a non-sequitur (NPR being the exception that proves the rule), there's no work there for an actor anyway. American theatre? Concerts? You know what? You are right. There isn't anything but films in this country.

I find the attitude that US standards of life and work are the benchmark by which all actors' lives and careers are to be measured to be provincial and condescending. Then you misread what I've said. Apparently, you only view the extreme ends of the continuum: People magazine covers and...whatever. There is more IMO. There are respected actors, talented and who haven't sold out for glitz, but who shrewdly do enough to have name recognition, which counts so much in casting decision. Movies are a business. My last words on the subject are that I'm not apologetic about my own culture and never attempt to hold it above anyone else's as superior. I have too much respect for all cultures to do so. and, btw, we try to stay away from personalizing comments when it might be interpreted as name-calling.

(Anne)We need to educate the masses to watch the good rather than the crass. Please Evelyn do not be offended but that I truly believe is how it is. Honey..I'm not offended, but I am stunned at your naivete. Please go back and read his latest interviews...esp. the pathetic one: "I want to be respected...I want to be prosperous...I want to get good roles". Obviously anyone who is happy in the present state of his career, would not be making this statement.Nor do I consider it crass for him to wish for these things. He is a normal human being who likes to be recognized for his endeavors.And who sees lesser talented people "get the gravy". When I sat in front of the TV last night and saw Kenneth Branngh introduced as "the distinguished British actor"...and thought that both he and SD were supporting actors to Colin in previous films....both less talented than he...I could have cried.

KarenR said "and, btw, we try to stay away from personalizing comments when it might be interpreted as name-calling" Eh? "personalizing"?? "name-calling"??? I'm sorry, where did I do either? Unless your name is American Television, in which case I called you crap. For which I apologize, Ms. Television. The only person I mentioned was Colin Firth.

I'm inclined to say let's show some tolerance, especially as having met our kind and generous bucket host, I know her to be incredibly tolerant herself and a cultural oasis too!( put a lot of Brits to shame too). KJ's card said most of what I feel (given at 3dOR) about our group and without Karen's driving energy and generosity we wouldn't have half the OBD stuff we do. Personal enough? Oh dear must be a bad hair day :�)) Seriously let's do what we do here best , drooling. Someone put up a gorgeous picture of ODB and quick!! After 12 hours in an office I need dimples and big brown eyes (kohl rimmed or not!).

I do not wish to be polemic, but I believe Karen was referring to: (luvvy), I find the attitude that US standards of life and work are the benchmark by which all actors' lives and careers are to be measured to be provincial and condescending. I happen to think that, in general, US TV is crap. I also think that BBC/America is crap.

Karen, if you're Ms. Television, and Milton Berle used to be Mr. Television, does that make you . . .hmmm, he's about 107, rich as Croesus, and badly in need of somebody to leave all that money to!;-) For those of us who read discontent into CF's recent remarks, there seems to be a disconnect between his professional choices and his aspirations. We look at the poor reception to some of his recent work and we see a guy who needs to change horses pretty quickly if indeed he wants respect, esteem, prosperity, the good roles, etc. We compare his achievements to those of his peers (and I think Evelyn nailed it in the statement about wanting to cry last night when seeing Branagh and Dillane), and we hate to see him settle for less, much less. Then to read him possibly signing on for more of the same, well, it's disappointing. Having said that, I do understand that some others may not see it the same way. As for crap, we all--every country represented here--has its strengths and weaknesses, just as every person has, but certainly there is more to admire in each other than not. It's been my pleasure to get to know Karen, and her attitudes are neither provincial nor condescending. But she sure will be rolling in it once Uncle Miltie croaks.;-);-)

I think we're *all* Jasperizing at the moment! ;-D (As we, of course, have every right to do.) I'll jasperize enough to say that on the whole, I tend to agree with Chris. I was never happier for Colin than when I felt he had finally decided to stick with the "home" country. It has the disadvantage of its media industry not getting the support it deserves, but the advantage of at least being the source of a much greater variety of roles on offer and a potential audience for them. That is not to guarantee the roles will all be plums or that everyone working in the U.K. media are competant at what they do, but I think he increased his chances of getting the kinds of roles he wanted about 300% by deciding to stick with Britain. (Chris)so much American television is total crap, he'd have a hard time being proud of such a job. And since intelligent American radio is a non-sequitur (NPR being the exception that proves the rule), there's no work there for an actor anyway. American theatre? Concerts? You know what? You are right. There isn't anything but films in this country. And how many Americans genuinely appreciate and admire the craft of acting, even among their own? They are more likely to attune their approval on whether or not the guy is gorgeous and "a real man" and hope he is violent enough to get good box office so he can go play the same part again. all he wants is for people to think he is a good actor The people who will think he is a good actor are the people who appreciate the craft and respect it in all of its forms. He'll be more likely find his appreciative audience abroad than in the US.

We've never agreed on any of these points, but let's have tolerance for others' points of view and not resort to ridicule or other demeaning comments. OK, am up to Chapter Six in my "Diplomatic and Gracious Hosting for Dummies" book. ;-)

(Lizza) Someone put up a gorgeous picture of ODB and quick!! After 12 hours in an office I need dimples and big brown eyes (kohl rimmed or not!). Your wish is my command. I have a new one, but am going to work on it now. Will put up later and am interested to hear where you all think it was taken. :-)

As I'm prone to a particularly viriulent case of virtual foot in mouth disease, I'll offer my views on CF's career. Perhaps he had too easy when he started, and thus never had to really pursue quality work -- it came to him. Seriously, taken in overview his career in the 1980's was nothing short of charmed. The Drama Centre stages its one and only production of "Hamlet"; who should snag the celebrated role of the Dane but CF. Then it gets to be even more of a fairy tale, an agent is in the audience, and behold he gets cast in the lead of the West End hit "Another Country". Then he's cast as the second lead in the film version. There are also leading roles in the top quality films "A Month in the Country" and "Apartment Zero". Of course, there's "Valmont". Milos Forman's search for the vicomte was almost as epic as Selznick's for Scarlett O'Hara. Out of all the young actors who auditioned, quess who gets the part? Why, CF, of course. Also "Tumbledown" should be noted. Yes, it was done for television, but it ealt with an important and painful subject. CF also won an award for it. It would seem that in his twenties, CF could do no wrong. That all seems to have changed. Now he inhabits the "real world", as it were. The roles don't fall easily to him anymore. He sees his contemporaries surpassing him. Why? Perhaps it is because he never had to hone his survival skills as an actor since he never really was a struggling actor. I do think that, overall, he is a successful actor. He has supported himself well for almost twenty years on his income as an actor. Most working actors cannot say that. He also can be proud of most of the projects in which he has been involved. That's my two cents, anyway. I just could be all wet in my analysis.

I applaud everything Luvvy said. She/he made a lot of sense.

Wading in here..I'm not sure where to start! Firstly, although it makes me look as though I'm operating in a different time zone, I've actually seen MLSF! It was a horrid rainy day, and I went with fairly low-keyed expectations, but I have to say that I really enjoyed it. I tend to go into hyper critical mode when watching anything of CF's , and so sometimes can't enjoy the experience. But I liked MLSF ...it has charm, and all the performances are very good. It was episodic, but I had no problem with this. I spoke to one of the Museum staff afterwards and said that that I was pleased that they were showing it. He said that they had great difficulty in getting hold of a print as the distributors couldn't care less about it. I feel sad for him about this...he deserves much better. I guess this is one of the reasons I'm keen on good TV work. It does reach its audience, and, in the UK certainly, is a respected medium. But I do accept that film is a much more accessible and high profile medium for the US. (at least he's doing BJD...I'm sure this will be a multi-million dollar smash...and he'll have to give interviews!) There was actually something on the radio today about the proposed New Labour drama. A BBC spokesman said that they were very excited about it...the script was going to be "first-rate" and "very thought-provoking" they were looking to put together the highest calibre cast possible. They didn't have a date for filming...maybe the end of the year, for transmission in Spring. I wouldn't rule out Kevin Stacey's involvement. I remember reading that when he was in Lodon doing "The Iceman Cometh" he was very friendly with Peter Mandelson (Mandelson moves in artistic circles). I'd rather see CF doing something like this (and the excellent "Armadillo") in addition to movies, which can be so unpredictable. And of course theatre. It would be very nice indeed to see him getting the respect and acclaim that JE and SD, deservedly, are getting. No more CF-wetshirt comments (there was actually one in the Times a couple of days ago...let it be, please!) Okay, back to Drool!

Spacey, sorry!

Lizza, while Karen is getting her picture ready, here is some Kohl-lined for you to gaze at and remember -- and it is from television -- how about that! Seriously, everyone has made good points in this discussion. I think those of us who have followed CF for some time are disappointed that his career has not taken off. For folk like me, being an accomplished actor in many media in the UK is not enough. I personally would love to see him get the international attention Russell Crowe is getting right now. We should remind ourselves that he is a star in England, and always will be. I just wish it had spread further aboard. When I still have to tell people who he is by mentioning SIL - "you know Lord Wessex?" That says something I'm not particularly glad to admit. But, many fine actors found their "role" at 40. He still has time -- and more than enough talent.

Sorry...

(Mari) For those of us who read discontent into CF's recent remarks... An excellent way of putting that not all of us do read discontent into CF's recent remarks. And I doubledare you to call me naive, Evelyn. ;-) Actually, I think it makes me skeptical as hell because I scarcely believe anything I read in articles. It's all what the writer/editor chooses to tell us. Whew! Anyway, I don't think anyone is really too worked up over the percieved state of his career. There are other more weighty matters. Such as what's with the big hair MarkG reports Colin is sporting as Mark Darcy!? And Karen, what picture could you be finessing? Don't keep us in suspense too long, dear. I am so glad you saw MLSF, Bethan, and glad you told us here. I'd love to hear what charms you found in it. KJ, what is "jasperizing"? Sounds fascinating.

40 is a mystical number. Maybe we just have to wait for September 10th. ;-)

Lookie Here

(Heide)And I doubledare you to call me naive, Evelyn. ;-) Actually, I think it makes me skeptical as hell because I scarcely believe anything I read in articles. It's all what the writer/editor chooses to tell us. Sometimes I believe what are in quotations in an article .. but I scarcely believe what some people post on drool:-D

Karen asks: Where was that picture taken? 1. At Prince Charles's party recently? The one where the Queen finally said a cool hello to Camilla? Whereever it was, he looks good. A little thicker around the neck. Is he lifting weights?

YOWZA! Here's something on which we all can agree: that is one fine looking fellow! I have a feeling Moon will approve of this outfit.:-) I'll guess: the AMFAR benefit at Cannes

Mmmmm, nice. But I wouldn't want to jasperize... (Heide) KJ, what is "jasperizing"? Sounds fascinating. Re: Rees Article in the Times glossy magazine, May 6: Response 922, KJArt, Mon May 8, Jasper is enamoured of "positing" and it really shows in his language, as he hedges when he's simply inventing what he wants to believe about Colin. Response 1002, Eileen, May 9, 2000 We've been doing the same thing as Jasper -- projecting our own interpretations into CF's words . \...\ It's human nature to do this. Response 1015 Mari, May 9 Just me Jasper-ing away here . . .;-) Response 1039, Lisa JH Wed, May 10 First there was "doing a Harvey;" now we have "pulling a Jasper." Too funny... We turned the proper noun into a verb. It can take many forms; I was just trying out 'jasperize' as an alternate form of the verb, meaning "to conjecture according to one's wont" or as Eileen so succinctly put it ...."projecting our own interpretations into CF's words". Mary, now, knows exactly when she is "pulling a Jasper", and lets us know it... 1418, Mary Murphy, June 5 I personally would love to see him ... We should remind ourselves ... I just wish ... Tres honest, no?

(KJArt) The people who will think he is a good actor are the people who appreciate the craft and respect it in all of its forms. He'll be more likely find his appreciative audience abroad than in the US. Oh, please don't tell this to a group of people who crossed an ocean twice to see him on the stage. That appreciative audience in his home country doesn't go to see the movies in which he stars. Either: A.) that is not an art form that they respect, or B) the roles he's taking don't turn them on. "A" would be a gross overstatement (of which I've seen a few here today) so that leaves B, which means they have the same opinion some of us do.

(Karen) I'm calling it "The Bouquet" these days. ;-) LOL! Now that's funny ;-) (Mari) Primary Colors, a very good film, did poorly abroad, and underperformed in the U.S. as well. (Evelyn) They don't do well in-country either....I never watch-em. They get poor ratings.Boorrrrring. I tend to agree that politics in film is a very hit or miss topic. However, if you haven't seen Primary Colors, then you should, Evelyn. As Mari said, it's a very good film. You should rent it, if only for Kathy Bates, who steals every scene she's in, chews it up and spits it back out. A woman after my own heart ;-p Evelyn) YIPEE....THEY WON!! Congratulations, honey! I'm as excited for you as Jennifer ;-) Since I already had my say about Colin's career (in a verbose post last week) I'll stay out of the current debate. ...except to say that Mari's Uncle Miltie comment had me rolling ;-D (Heide) Such as what's with the big hair MarkG reports Colin is sporting as Mark Darcy!? Now this is of major import ;-p Big hair, indeed!

Test

I swear I closed the tags, but okay...I'll close 'em again. I love Yapp. I love Yapp...c'mon, everybody...I love Yapp... ;-/

That happened to me yesterday on 127. I KNEW I closed the bold, but...

This is to keep your eyes busy while I continue to screw with tags... From Renate's archives ;-)

(Mari) I'll guess: the AMFAR benefit at Cannes That was my guess too, but I couldn't get confirmation. Just checked my Cannes footage and seems right. A tag reminder: If you think you subsequently closed the tag, then you probably have. But if the offending *open* tag is still up on the screen, then it won't show. Leave the topic. Come back and go back one to see your *corrected* post. Oooooooooohhhhhhh, neat picture! Thanks for posting it, Nan.

Ooooooo! Delish!! Thanks, Nan (Mari) Oh, please don't tell this to a group of people who crossed an ocean twice to see him on the stage. Of course I consider all of us to be the exceptions that prove the rule. :-) That appreciative audience in his home country doesn't go to see the movies in which he stars. Either: A.) that is not an art form that they respect, or B) the roles he's taking don't turn them on. Don't forget: C) They didn't approve of the final form these projects took. And the majority of that is out of his hands. "A" would be a gross overstatement Seems to me someone was complaining of this just the other day...something about they usually wait for the video..... ;-) so that leaves B, which means they have the same opinion some of us do. All a matter of taste. You saw MLSF (the final product). Did you consider that an unworthy project for him to do? I didn't, in spite of the fact that the powers that be cut it to ribbons and refused to promote or distribute it. CF has to call them as he sees them, *before* they're made, and he's not clairvoyant. He's taking the chances that I recall someone here was complaining that the US media don't take (only their expression for that failure was a bit stronger ... :-D) and taking chances means courting failure every time.. He takes TV roles because TV is a respected medium where he takes them. He takes the types of roles he hasn't done before or with which he has not been associated before. "It's just that I want to do interesting work," he says, with feeling.\...\ "I actually asked to play that role because I felt it was something I hadn't done before." He takes the roles that are interesting to *him* ... not necessarily interesting to us. I haven't decided whether a stuttering masturbatory village pervert would appeal to me, but I don't deny him the privilege of aspiring to such a role...( he's the one who's got to play it!! ;-D)(Or should I say GETS to play it? **Heehee**) (CF) I'm not hugely ambitious in those directions [attention, power]. As much as the next person, I want to be approved of, but I'm not greedy for that stuff. It's not where life's blessings lie as far as I'm concerned. He's only been saying the same thing over and over for the last few years. When are we going to start *listening* to the man? OK, I'll get off the soap.box now. KJ, still running off at the keyboard... = 8-D

When are we going to start *listening* to the man? Just like you can prove anything you want with numbers, you can do the same with words. Face it, no one is going to convince anybody of anything with this argument. There's absolutely no way to confirm his views on the state of his career, whether he is offered the kind of roles he wants or is content. His personal life is no concern of mine. I'd like to close with Bethan's words: I feel sad for him about this...he deserves much better. Amen

(KJArt) Don't forget: C) They didn't approve of the final form these projects took. How could someone approve or disapprove of what they haven't seen? Now, in fairness to the movie-going public, no matter if it's the U.S., the U.K., or elsewhere, the distributors didn't exactly make it easy for people to see. (KJArt) You saw MLSF (the final product). Did you consider that an unworthy project for him to do? I didn't, in spite of the fact that the powers that be cut it to ribbons and refused to promote or distribute it. Hey, I liked it, remember? But it's not the stuff that appeals to the general public and until he does that (and BJD might be a great way), moviegoers will stay away and he won't get the parts that now routinely go to his peers. As for cutting it to ribbons, films that are working don't get edited for the hell of it. If someone thought it trite, meandering and episodic (criticisms leveled at it by those who didn't like it) then 120 minutes instead of 95 would have only brought 25 more minutes of trite, meandering and episodic. Hey, I can subtract!;-) As for *listening to him,* I could also cite quotes to support various points of view because he's inconsistent. I'll also get off my soapbox now. No hard feelings, anyone. At least we're all passionate enough to discuss it, though we may disagree.

And lest we forget.....CF is at this very moment playing the romantic lead in a movie which will be promoted (and extremely well promoted) as "from the same team that brought you the hugely successful 4 Weddings and Notting Hill". Both NH and 4W took over $300 million dollars worldwide. From what Mark has posted, it sounds like a 10 week shoot....this will be a major film worldwide! And perhaps we might even get a sequel!

Bethan: I agree that BJD will be a major film. It seems to me, though, (Jasperizing, KJ!) that the downside will be that this will link him even closer in people's eyes as a Darcy, Mark or Fitzwilliam. Is that bad? I don't know. If you have your performance of Darcy to leave as a legacy, that ain't bad! But hasn't he said (somewhere) that he doesn't want to be remembered solely for that? Though I think recent interviews show that he has come to terms with the Darcy icon thing. A final comment -- Even with P&P, over here in the USA, not enough people saw it to make a national impact. It was on a cable channel, and only available to those who could get cable.

One downside about TV, which I hesitated to post. is that it can be equally unpredictable, at least as far as CF is concerned. For all UK-ers, I phoned up re. a scheduling date for DQ, as I thought they might have one by now. And was told, horror upon horrors, no date, tentatively 2001. I phoned another number to complain, and was told, "no transmission date...it's down as having gone out in 1999. Maybe it was just shown in Scotland." Well, it sure wasn't!! They are looking into it for me, and will ring me back. I'm not a pessimist but I really have no more hopes for this...spring, summer, autumn, 2001, difficult to schedule, already gone out. Something has happened to this (it was based on a real-life Bus company...are they sueing?)...it's no go. The tragedy is that it's a very good drama, by a BAFTA winning team, and starring the "most popular actor in 60 years of the BBC." Words fail me. Give the guy some good luck, puh-leese!

PS. This is �1.25 million of British tax payer's money. We have the right to see it! If anyone has a spare moment, please write or email the BBC for a scheduling date for DQ (and not 2001!)

Bethan, maybe they are trying to latch on to the CF publicity once BJD is out in 2001. YOWZA! Here's something on which we all can agree: that is one fine looking fellow! I have a feeling Moon will approve of this outfit.:-) What friends we have become! You know me well. I think he looks reat! Finally a tux the way I like, with the skinny 1960s bowtie. True connoiseur, bravo! Thank you Colin for listening! I do not think it was Cannes because they were in rehearsals for BJD. What about the opening of the Tate Modern Gallery?

Cannes, last year, when MLSF played at the AmFAR benefit. and...BJD is what we are all hoping will change things. Sometimes I have nightmares thinking that Universal didn't want him for the role and that Working Title had to fight to get him accepted. Grrr Am glad it worked out and that it leads to better roles in better projects.

Bethan, maybe they are trying to latch on to the CF publicity once BJD is out in 2001. He doesn't need publicity, not for a BBC programme. Actually, I do believe we'll see it....sometime, okay, 2001. I just find it very frustrating not to get a straight answer. My job involves getting information...and I'm usually successful! For DQ, I've drawn a blank.

Cannes, last year, when MLSF played at the AmFAR benefit. This picture is a year old and we never happen to see it???

ooh, I just thought of an idea. A game sort of what Francoise used to do on the CF List only with pictures. Post a pic and try to find out what movie it came from? this one is a giver;) Now you can't cheat and check the url either;)

Bethan, I just can't believe this, I really thought we would finally see it aired this Autumn. What is going on Anna Karenina (sp?) was filmed after DQ,. same Director and has already been shown, why is it always CF projects? We had to wait ages for Nostromo but I think that was because it wasn't considered all that good for what it cost to make but this, (DQ) is good very good. When they say it has already been shown do you think they mean Australia!! I have an idea Bethan and other UK fans, you are right we should be allowed to see this drama, we have paid our license fees, I have tried writing to the Letters page at Ceefax (BBC) about DQ and the letter has not been shown, even though letters I have written in the past have, so I think we should all write to (Teletext - ITV) asking when we may expect to see the BBC drama DQ (starring CF) which was completed over a year ago and which has already been shown in Australia and asking if he has any information on DQ, etc and when we may expect to see it on our TV screens. Telextext being ITV may be more forthcoming and at the very least may show our letters. I shall write this week, Teletext letters are shown at the weekend, Ceefax letters are shown daily. Ceefax (BBC) email address box.ceefax@bbc.co.uk can't find Teletext email address, should be there Saturday, Teletext page 110 will show Letters page on Saturday, to write, however, here is the address: Letters, Teletext, PO Box 297, London SW6 1XT.

(Murph) ...that the downside will be that this will link him even closer in people's eyes as a Darcy, Mark or Fitzwilliam. Good point...I hadn't even thought of that. I was just so delighted that he accepted the role, mostly because it means (to me anyway) that he has a sense of humor about himself, Darcy and the whole P&P2 phenomenon. I find that very attractive and my good opinion of him was, again, reinforced. I just love when that happens ;-) (Murph)Is that bad? I don't know. If you have your performance of Darcy to leave as a legacy, that ain't bad! Well, to always be associated with one of the most excellent male characters in fiction doesn't suck, that's for sure ;-) With all the handsome, fine actors there are in the world I still cannot think of one who could have personified Darcy as well as Colin. Each time I watch it, I'm amazed at how closely he resembles the Darcy of my girlhood imagination, both physically and in mannerisms. But hasn't he said (somewhere) that he doesn't want to be remembered solely for that? To constantly be reminded of that one role must get old, I imagine. On the other hand, things like that can also open doors. Look at Patrick Stewart, who is a wonderful actor with amazing presence (and sexy as all get out, too ;-p). He can do Shakespeare until he's blue in the face, but he will always be Captain Picard. I've seen him interviewed about this same topic and, while he admits that he would prefer to do more "important" work, he is (I'm paraphrasing here) "so grateful to Star Trek for giving me choices". So, if Colin rides the P&P bandwagon (which he always seemed to want to avoid) by taking the BJD role and that opens other doors for him, then it simply can't be a negative thing. If it's really successful, he'll have the opportunity and, more importantly, the power to choose in which direction his career will go. Well, that's what I'm hoping for anyway :-/

Jasper is enamoured of "positing" and it really shows in his language, as he hedges when he's simply inventing what he wants to believe about Colin. With all due respect, KJ, that's what you are doing too.... It's infectious;-) ~~~~~~ (Nan)I tend to agree that politics in film is a very hit or miss topic. However, if you haven't seen Primary Colors, then you should, Evelyn. As Mari said, it's a very good film Nan, I saw "Primary Colors" and read the book. Woof, woof.... a)I perfer to see John Travolta dancing, b)Emma Thompson's American(?) accent was affected c) It was still borrring. ~~~~~~ Sorry about DQ UKers.You seem to have TV problems. I don't think it will ever show in the US. (And count me OUT about writing to any station to cajole them into showing it either.) I want Colin on Broadway My gang got a Tony each...(she said *glowingly*)... poor Colin only has a Wet Shirt and no one seems to give a damn. So there!

I have an idea Bethan and other UK fans, you are right we should be allowed to see this drama, we have paid our license fees,I have tried writing to the Letters page at Ceefax (BBC) about DQ and the letter has not been shown, even though letters I have written in the past have, so I think we should all write to (Teletext - ITV) asking when we may expect to see the BBC drama DQ Ann, I think any action on this would be a good idea! I'm feeling quite militant about this...although I have calmed down a bit (2001 was like a red rag to a bull to me...WOT!!WOT!!!!) The BBC isn't exactly awash with good drama at the moment! I'm sure we will see DQ sometime but confirmation would be reassuring! I tried three numbers...general enquiries ( reply: 2001), BBC Publicity drama/information (1999?) and BBC Scotland Drama department. All were very nice and helpful...just couldn't give me the information I wanted to hear! I would suggest ringing BBC Scotland (0141 338 2000) and asking for the Drama department. You're connected straightaway. They were very pleasant and actually rang me back. They made DQ, but have no responsibility at all for scheduling it. This is done by another department (who should all be sacked!) They noted my address and promised to send transmission details when available. I think it would be a good idea for anyone who is interested in seeing DQ on screen to ring BBC Scotland (Drama) and say you're looking forward very much to seeing DQ (and this year, 2000!) and please could they let you know when there's a date for transmission or perhaps when it has been sold to other territories. As I say, they're the creative people who actually made the programme and it's good to let them know there's interest in it. Programes not even made are being scheduled for 2001. Autumn 2000 makes sense! (Maybe 2001 is a computer error!) Go to it! Karen, do you still have your source of information for DQ? If it's really successful, he'll have the opportunity and, more importantly, the power to choose in which direction his career will go. (Nan) Power...that's the word. Being in control, rather than being controlled!

So, if he's so *hot* in the UK, why are they putting his film on a shelf..?? This attitude seems to imply that's he's not so hot, maybe. That perhaps he's "yesterday's news"...and it doesn't make any dif when they show it. BBC is a straaaaaange entity.And this is what you want to chain him to?? "Tis a mystery"

(Mari)But it's not the stuff that appeals to the general public and until he does that (and BJD might be a great way), moviegoers will stay away and he won't get the parts that now routinely go to his peers. When he does that, though, others might stay away...American Pie, Bid Daddy, another Escape from Alcatraz, Armaggedon... starring Colin Firth? Yikes! BTW, I tried to watch Primary Colors almost two years ago and hated it. Not that it matters.

(Mari) he won't get the parts that now routinely go to his peers. (Gi) American Pie, Bid Daddy, another Escape from Alcatraz, Armaggedon... starring Colin Firth? Which of his peers starred in these movies? I think you all know, these are not the movies to which we are referring.

C'mon Gi...sometimes we make good movies. Not all of them are crap. Besides....those films only reflect the taste of the people who attend. ;-)

(Evelyn) C'mon Gi...sometimes we make good movies. Not all of them are crap. I know, dear! American films are actually the ones I watch and enjoy most of the time. I only meant that the "general public"'s tastes are not necessarily what we *all* here would like to see Colin in, either. Anyway, perhaps, as in painting and most other arts, everything has already been said in cinema. You can have boy meets girl, cops and robbers, alien monsters, basic humour... How many different ways are there to tell the same half a dozen stories with a couple of cameras? So I don't know what to wish for Colin or what to expect of him. I don't mind re-watching P&P anyway :-)

I did not like Primary Colors, either. If you want Kathy Bates try Misery. The male role in that film would have been great for Colin( could have brought his AZ strangeness out). if Colin rides the P&P bandwagon (which he always seemed to want to avoid) by taking the BJD role and that opens other doors for him, then it simply can't be a negative thing. If it's really successful, he'll have the opportunity and, more importantly, the power to choose in which direction his career will go. I agree, Nan! For once let P&P work for you. There were some people who thought he should not take the MD role because it would forever associate him to Darcy. I will not mention smelling the coffee. ;-)

Pictures from the 3DOR gala and other Donmar mailings supplied by Evelyn: http://www.spring.net/karenr/general/donmar/galas.html

Thanks, Karen! DLDLDLDLDL;-)))))))))

STOP PRESS RE DQ ****************** Radio Times issued today states that location filming has just finished and it will be seen "NEXT WINTER" Not so long after all!! Thanks for all the lovely scrummy pics Murph, Nan et al Really appreciated.

On DQ -(Bethan) I think we should all write to Teletext - ITV Lizza J -Radio Times issued today states that location filming has just finished I'm with you on this one Bethan let's bombard them and the Radio Times too. That well-respected orifice , I mean oracle. JUST FINISHED indeed! How long ago was it shown in Oz? How long have we been aching to see this show? Do they really think they can pull the wool over our eyes in this way? Can I think up any more questions? Answers on a postcard please to Greg Dyke c/o BBC. It's all very straaaange ((c) Evelyn) Thanks BTW for the delish pix - back to some real drooling

STOP PRESS RE DQ I DON'T BELIEVE IT, it sounds as if the right hand doesn't know what the left fhand is doing, AGAIN. Bethan just reported that it was not scheduled!! BTW Bethan you didn't say how many people were in the cinema for MLSF, or did you have an exclusive viewing like Allison?

Lizza J it will be seen "NEXT WINTER" Not so long after all!! Ah but do they mean next winter in a normal type way i.e. at the end of this year or are they spouting 'BBC speak' where next winter could mean anything from the back end of 2001 to early 2002. Who knows! Donovan Quick - I'd have sooner have called it Donovan-bloody-Slothlike! (apologies to those who may have made a similar pun and for language which is not that strong for over here but may not travel well) Soapbox now safely descended from - I feel so much better

(Gi)I don't mind re-watching P&P anyway :-) I'm telling ya'...it's part of my religion:-)

Radio Times issued today states that location filming has just finished and it will be seen "NEXT WINTER" WOT! WOT! WOT, WOT, WOT!!!!!!! Well, I go to the bottom of the class, I really do! Didn't the same thing happen when I phoned up about MLSF and was told there was no premiere, it wasn't at the Curzon etc.. Is it me, or what? "Location filming has just finished" ? Pardon? Oh well, I won't quibble....I'm just happy to see a DATE! Perhaps I should phone the BBC and tell them! Thanks Lizza! You've beaten me hollow here! :-)

Good scanning Karen... 3 DOR Gala in London netted 41,000 UKP Did you see David Leveaux , Moon? So how come you didn't post that TRT Gala in NY netted 96,000 UKP!! But Steven Speilberg gave $1. Million!!alone.......LOL.

Did you know a sloth can move so slowly fungus will actually grow on its fur. KJ, I use the word "posit". I also enjoy "positing", and my name is not, never has been, nor ever will be "Jasper." Something ironic occured to me reading through all of these recent posts. (Mine included.) Why so much disparagement towards CF working in television? Wasn't it television which gave him his best known role to date -- Fitzwilliam Darcy.

(Cheryl)Why so much disparagement towards CF working in television? Wasn't it television which gave him his best known role to date -- Fitzwilliam Darcy. We are v. grateful to the BBC/A&E and mean no disparagementas a genre.. but some of us think it's time ODB graduate to bigger and better things. And IMHO it would be theatre which he does so well (having seen him five times on three separate crossings over the pond...same play!!!)

Yes. I would love for him to theater in New York, either Broadway or Off-Broadway. I could actually go to see him on stage. Time really shouldn't be too much of a constraint for him. Actors that have recurring roles on American tv series, (22 episodes per year), very often do New York theater when their series take the annual production break. CF was also in two Oscar winning films. There's nothing wrong with being a supporting actor. Some of the best written parts are supporting roles. Besides the wonderful actor Robert Duvall has spent most of his career in supporting roles.

Bethan - Should I phone the BBC and tell them LOL, seriously Bethan I think you should.

Did I mention that the snippet on DQ (response to a RT reader's enquiry about CF) had a thumbnail snappy. They don't stint those BBC execs do they? Actually the reader who sent in the query is really Bethan!! Has to be ! But of course the question about what CF "an RT favourite" is doing now , was received in 1998. Good going Bethan. Slothlike enough for you Tracy! Send in those darling little queries about a special role to mark ODB's 50th NOW!! Be too late otherwise.

(Karen) Am glad it worked out and that it [BJD] leads to better roles in better projects. Amen and hal-lay-luuuu-ya, Sistah Karen. I'm to the point where I don't care about the medium in which he works--radio, TV, movies, theater, making shadow puppets on the wall... (CCheryl)Actors that have recurring roles on American tv series, (22 episodes per year), very often do New York theater when their series take the annual production break. I always chuckle a bit when I see who's being cycled into some of these long-running projects (who *didn't* play the role of Rizzo in Grease? Even Lucy Lawless did, for gawd's sake). It's such an obvious audience-grabbing, money-hungry strategy. Art, shmart! (Tracy) Donovan Quick - I'd have sooner have called it Donovan-bloody-Slothlike! LMAO! (Bethan) I'm just happy to see a DATE! Hate to burst your bubble, but 'next winter' isn't a date. It could mean (as Tracy pointed out) 2001, as you were told. (Lizza) Send in those darling little queries about a special role to mark ODB's 50th NOW!! Be too late otherwise. LMAO again! But the Beeb sure can't wait to air this political drama, which hasn't even been written yet. When there's an agenda, there's an agenda.

Too funny, Lizza! Will we still be around for ODBs 50th? (Evelyn), Did you see David Leveaux , Moon? Oui, oui, Madame! Tres beau. :-D

(Evelyn) Nan, I saw "Primary Colors" and read the book...Woof, woof.... LOL! Don't mince words, honey...tell us how you really feel ;-p My opinion about Kathy Bates, stands. a)I perfer to see John Travolta dancing I quite agree ;-) (Gi) American Pie, Bid Daddy, another Escape from Alcatraz, Armaggedon... starring Colin Firth? (Karen) Which of his peers starred in these movies? I think you all know, these are not the movies to which we are referring. True. I'm thinking Jeremy Northam, rather than Ben Affleck. I'm not even thinking Hugh Grant (though it would be great if he were to have that choice, if he wanted it). BTW, I happen to love Escape from Alcatraz ;-p I have this weird fascination with prison films...

(Tracy) Donovan-bloody-Slothlike! LOL! I always said you know how to turn a phrase, Tracy.:-) Keep agitating the Beeb, ladies. Can't hurt. a)I prefer to see John Travolta dancing See? Even the biggies get typecast. Colin can't shake off Darcy and John can't shake off Tony Manero. CF is a wet shirt, JT is a white suit.;-) RE my previous post on CF's career--Now, you all *know* I wasn't talking about the crapola. What I had in mind was: --When a deep pockets studio decides to buy a Nick Hornby novel for a major big screen adaptation, that they hand it to CF, not John Cusack (though he did a good job in HF) and not Hugh Grant (who has snared About A Boy). --That when CF wants to do an ensemble comedy with a funny American director, please God, let it be Woody Allen (as HG has just done, to good reviews) and not Mike Binder. --That when Madden or Minghella or Scorsese or Mann are casting their next lead, we get CF and not Nic Cage or Fiennes, or Jude Law, or Daniel Day Lewis or Russell Crowe. Ditto Neil Jordan. --When Sam Mendes/the Donmar is producing the next play that has Broadway potential, that CF gets it. I'd even happily settle for Sam's next movie gig.:-) I'll stop now, but that's the general idea.:-) These fellows get first crack at the good stuff because they've proven themselves *in lead roles* in films that did well with audiences--not all blockbusters, but good, popular, critically acclaimed films. It's a building process; each new role that CF takes should be geared toward laying the foundation.

Hate to burst your bubble, but 'next winter' isn't a date. It could mean (as Tracy pointed out) 2001, as you were told I cannot see how "next winter" could mean THIS winter. Surely they are referring to 2001! That is it. I shall write. To the Radio Times and to the BBC. I do not think that Ceefax and Teletext are much concerned. They only seem to print letters abut the current TV output.

I do not think Ceefax and Teletext are much concerned...., I Just thought Allison that if a letter was shown on C or T, it would shame and blame the BBC and would bring it to attention of other CF fans (not on the Internet) and perhaps the BBC might explain themselves if more people go in touch with them. Just a thought.

Do you not think that publicizing *another* CF project that is languishing on a shelf somewhere a bad idea?

No, as Bethan said we TV License payers have a right to see it.

and it hurts me to say this but DQ is good, very good whereas SLOW, well wasn't.

I am in the minority here but I did not think DQ was very good. (and I do not mind ducking tomatoes, they are my favourite fruit.) ;-)

Aside from the right to see it, I just meant that DQ would become additional fodder for the journalists, i.e., another project "termed" losers like MLSF, SLOW...

I just meant that DQ would become additional fodder for the journalists, i.e., another project "termed" losers like MLSF, SLOW... Negative ammunition...just what they want and CF doesn't need. Think about this. I think DQ is the best thing he has done in ten years...even if I could not understand a lot of the Scottish accent...(but that is my problem.) UK journalists are pathological liars...for those of us who saw the Tony's on TV...reading about them in your papers...is pure fiction. Imagine if they get hold of something that is true!

I find it hard to believe that they will hang on to DQ until 2001. It is not like cinama where they have to find a distributor. If they thought DQ was a turkey they would just show it during the summer. I have yet to see it (though if it really is scheduled for 2001 I may have to get hold of a copy) but I cannot believe it is not so bad that the BBC would not show it. Why would they wait? There are plenty of TV slots.

Run...don't walk...to your nearest Spring friend who has a copy...it is brilliant. (Though LOL...I'm afraid to build it up so much....look what happened to MLSF because I kept shooting my big mouth about it.);-)

(Allison) but I cannot believe it is not so bad that the BBC would not show it. It is not bad at all; in fact,it is wonderful. Remember that little news item about the poor ratings for television shows produced by the regional companies. Might be that BBC is afraid that DQ will suffer the same fate since it comes from the *provinces*

I find myself in a perpetual state of dumbfoundedness (clinically similar to flabbergastedness) about the BBC's treatment of DQ--initially, for failure to air it within a reasonable period after it was finished, now for reportedly postponing broadcast for another year. Why? Why? It is good--well written (hurrah!) and well acted. Evelyn has a point about MLSF. Many of us thought it was good and that it would be well received in Britain; we were wrong about its reception. Perhaps there's something condescending and provincial about the DQ story that we're missing on this side of the pond. ;-P Take Evelyn's advice, Allison.

Maybe they keep DQ for the Christmas program to push the quotes ;-))

(Renate)Maybe they keep DQ for the Christmas program to push the quotes ;-)) Nah...They're gonna repeat TTOTS ;-)

I have yet to see it (though if it really is scheduled for 2001 I may have to get hold of a copy) but I cannot believe it is not so bad that the BBC would not show it. Why would they wait? There are plenty of TV slots. (Allison) I've been fortunate to see a copy of DQ, courtesy of the intrepid Spring network. I can be perfectly objective about this, and say that it is indeed very good. On their last collaboration "Taking over the asylum", Donna Fairchild and David Blair won the Best Drama BAFTA, and this is from the same stable. I think it's part fable (the DQ theme) and part gritty reality, in keeping with the types of dramas that are popular at the moment. It's poignant, often humorous and features very good ensemble acting. As a bonus, CF is very handsome throughout, and we get a nice kiss thrown in for good measure at the end! Seriously though, this is not something the BBC should be sitting on. Whenever I've rung up about it, I've got the impression that there's something "wrong"...no-one is forthcoming. And the latest BBC statement ("just finished filming") is a lie! My theory is that there may have been some legal complications. There are soe parallels with real-life businesses (eg Stagecoach). A recent drama about the closure of the BBC picture library (better than it sounds ) starring Tim Spall, was delayed for nearly 2 years because of a libel action. I'm only guessing, but there must be something wrong behind the scenes...no problems with the actual quality. "Next winter" must be the winter that is approaching surely ...slack usage of language I admit, but it has to this year, or possibly Jan 2001. (When does winter end?). Christmas, New Year? Hopefully. But the whole business is definitely a mystery. Shades of Harvey and mis-information "for the role of Edward Miramax chose CF fresh from the success of SIL"!!! My final contribution (I promise!) to the Movie v. TV debate. I've a lot of sympathy with the pro-movie camp, and I do realise the international significance of movies, but there are times, maybe once or twice a year in the UK when a TV programme/drama can be a Major Event...something that everyone watches, talks about, rushes home to see etc. Something that really creates an impact. I think the best combination is a mix of high calibre TV and high profile movies...difficult, I know!

I think the best combination is a mix of high calibre TV and high profile movies...difficult, I know BUT I want Colin on Broadway Frankly,I Don't Care if the British public runs over women and children to get home...empties the pubs...to look at him on TV. Because, they DO NOT support his films.They only watch him when it's FREE!! AND they don't have to go out in the rain...Settle down in front of the ole "telly" THEATRE is his only hope to get out of that millieu that he's chained to.

My absolutely final last comment (good debate though!) I'm with you 100% on the theatre, Evelyn, and I'm sure that after such a positive experience in the Donmar, he'll do more. A depressing number of well-known British actors have given up on theatre because of rough handling from our delightful sabre-toothed critics...Alan Rickman, Anthony Hopkins, Jeremy Irons, Ken Branagh have all retired hurt. But CF is okay, thankfully! BTW didn't someone ask him about Broadway and he mentioned problems with the Actors'Union? But don't the Donmar also have some sort of special agreement? There's talk apparently of a revival later this year of Edward Albee's "Who's afraid of Virginia Woolf". Would love to see the 40-ish CF in the Richard Burton role. JE as Martha..too young? Good role though. And Sam Mendes seems to have a few new projects lined up for the Donmar (don't know what, except for the World War 1 drama)). Won't say any more in defence of the "telly"! We'll beg to differ here! But (final, final, last-ever, ever remark on the subject!) increasingly "success" of movies in the UK is also measured by video rentals/purchases, cable screenings etc. We're just not going to the movies any more. Richard Branson sold his Virgin chain of theatres because they weren't profitable. Right, that's it! :-)

(Mari)See? Even the biggies get typecast. Colin can't shake off Darcy and John can't shake off Tony Manero. CF is a wet shirt, JT is a white suit.;-) John was very good in Pulp Fiction. --When a deep pockets studio decides to buy a Nick Hornby novel for a major big screen adaptation, that they hand it to CF, not John Cusack (though he did a good job in HF) and not Hugh Grant (who has snared About A Boy). CF had Fever Pitch. Too bad. (Moon)I am in the minority here but I did not think DQ was very good. (and I do not mind ducking tomatoes, they are my favourite fruit.) ;-) Guess I'll join you, Moon. DQ is good, not *very* good. We can use those tomatoes to cook some pasta ;-) Sorry. Been working in E.R. all day...

A Former FOF suggested this pairing. He looks lovely at both ages: Then and Now Murph

Yum, I've always loved that photo on the right. Thanks, Mary. Like the young Colin too though I'll take the man over the boy anyday. Besides, the hair's just a little too big. Hope that's not his Mark Darcy look. ;-) That Donmar photo...well, I've seen better. He looks a bit wired. Now the one below of Colin as Walker..that's the Colin I adore. Great find of Colin in a tux. And the suit fits! Are you sure that's not Colin's head super-imposed on another man's body, Karen? Like Hugh Grant's? (Sorry, couldn't resist.) (Gi) Sorry. Been working in E.R. all day... Jeez, I've been reading "sorries" all over the place. Heaven forbid if anyone feels they have to apologize for going against the tide. Soak away those ER blues with more lovely Colin photos or throw P&P on the VCR again if the DH doesn't object. You know we don't take ourselves too seriously, my dear.

(Telegraph) TONY BLAIR yesterday suffered his biggest public relations fiasco since becoming Prime Minister when he was given a slow handclap and heckled by the massed ranks of the Women's Institute....The protest began mid-way through the Prime Minister's address to an audience of 10,000 at the WI conference at Wembley Arena, north London. As it gathered strength, Helen Carey, the chairman, appealed to members to give Mr Blair a polite hearing. Mr Blair, looking uneasy, dropped several sentences from his prepared speech, in which he called for a return to "traditional British values". At the end he appeared subdued as many WI members sat stony-faced, refusing to extend the customary applause. Maybe BBC can get Rik Mayall to play Blair?

Maybe BBC can get Rik Mayall to play Blair? Too funny Karen...and I've got a similar event vid of Rik with Jennifer that has a ribald "flashy" ending .

The July issue of Empire (at your news agents now) has the results of the online questions to Stephen Fry. Anybody care to thumb through it to see if there's anything on Relative Values or Londinium.

This was in an email from the Relative Values people:We know that there are many of you who will not be able to make it to the premiere - in which case the relative-values.com are planning to broadcast live on the night. BUT we need to hear from you so we can judge the popularity of this idea. Send an email to premiere@relative-values.com if you think this is a great idea and you would watch.So send them an email and tell them this is the greatest idea since sliced bread! I did.

I still say CF should be thankful he wasn't in Jordan's adaptation of "The End of the Affair". It blew. It was one of 1999's worst films with artistic intent. It missed. The Graham Greene novel is a terrific read, though. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt and assume he was basing his hope on the book and not the putrid NJ film. Personally, I don't really have a preference as to which medium CF works in, just so long as he keeps working.