First, the attributes which defines something as being Precious and Valuable. *It has to be durable, *It must be universally acknowledged as desirable, *It must be rare. There have been legends about eyes of idols which were fabulous gems from the Orient set into the center of worship in temples there. The Hope Diamond was one such stone, and what there is of it now is only half the original size. Diamonds come in many colors. The British Museum of Natural History has on display cut examples of diamonds in blood red, emerald green, Golden-yellow, Royal Blue, Turquoise, and various shades of champagne, pink and white. Each specimen is cut perfectly and sparklingly clear as a fine diamond should be. Some are so rare that they are tiny - as in the Greens and the Reds. The hardest substance on Earth is the Diamond at 10 on the Moh's Scale of Hardness, but they are brittle. Slam you hand against a porcelain sink and your diamond may shatter to pieces from some tiny flaw in the crystalline structure. Daimonds are, after all, the purest form of Carbon, and they will burn with a hot blue flame and turn into Carbon Dioxide. I would like to recommend you take me at my word on this - there is no way to get it back to being a diamond after it has been consigned to the flames.

tanzanite is a unique gem in that under different lights, the colors change. the colors range from deep sapphire blue, to purple, to gray when held on an angle. i thoroughly enjoy my piece of tanzanite and have noticed that they are increasing in popularity. sapphire also comes in a myriad of colors to include green, white, and red.

And so is Alexandrite which is amethyst under incandescent light and green in the daylight. Mine even turned blue one time when we were high in the Sierras on an exceptionally clear day. I am taking the stones and metals in descending order of hardness. Next is the Sapphire / Ruby group.

didn't know there was an order of business *grin* sapphire and ruby are members of the berile group right?

BTW, of all the colors a sapphire may be - they cannot be red. Then it is a ruby! All others are Sapphires. (Don't know why but am researching it)

Sapphires and Ruby are Corundum. Beryls are softer and include Emerald and Aquamarine

Wolf, as a fellow Emerald Baby, I lusted after that emerald green diamond I mentioned above. What a sparkle it had. That would have been some birthstone!

Ummmmm, I guess we will just go for which stones come up in discussion. No order unless no one posts. Then, I start teaching again (heaven help us *lol*)

wait, are you a june or may baby? i'm june, so alexandrite and pearl are my precious gems. have never cared for emerald that much. aquamarine is beautiful and i own three pieces. i forgot that ruby and sapphire were so closely related! i know the colors of some gems are directly related to an element found in their chemistry. off the top of my head, i can't think of what it's called!

May 31st is mine. Gemini is from May 22 to June 22? Something like that anyway. Never cared for emeralds; I also have three pieces set with aquamarine (pretty hard to come by these days) - one I set myself! Ruby is red due to iron and titanium makes them blue(very simply stated, and can be from other metallic salts as well.) Rutile filiment cause an asterism - a flaw, really - the result being a star ruby or a star sapphire (my original engagement ring!)

woohoo! you're right about gemini. mine is june 8. i see a lot of aquamarine in the jewelry departments here and tanzanite is about to get its own display shelf! of course, as the popularity increases, so does the price. found mine on a 50% off display and absolutely love it!

Wolf: i see a lot of aquamarine in the jewelry departments here Are you sure you are not seeing light topaz? It is everywhere and relatively inexpensive. BTW, do not purchase any Deep blue topaz. To get that lovely color they take clear topaz and irradiate it. The darker the color the more radiation. The really dark and lovely London blue is actually radioactive. Put that think on your finger and wear it all the time and you may have some serious problems! Tanzanite is lovely, but I Know a lady with a deep velvet indigo one. Stunning!

i knew about how they darken topaz, i don't own any. um, the aquamarine i'm seeing is marked as such. lighter topaz stones are with the darker stones.

Then, you are dealing with reputable jewellers. Beware of the ones who display the stones by color without identifying them. In cases like these it can save you a great deal of money and heartache - unless you are delighted with your stone and got what you think was a good deal on it Back to my Birthstone, the emerald. Since I do not care for them, I have been hunting for a green stone I do like. That is not easy. One visit to Britain I found a little second-hand shop and asked to see the jewelry - rings in particular. He brought out a tray of uninspired stuff, so I asked him if he had any tasteful Victorian items. He drolly remarked that I could have either Victorian or tasteful, but not both. I chose an Edwardian Bezel set deep green tournaline set in 18K gold. Very plain and very tasteful. I adore it and am very happy with it.

and in 18K! wow!! i believe there are two stones for each month, but i'll have to find a reference for that. tourmaline is famous for the watermelon colors, right?

there are at least two...I think I've run across about four for June...

Moonstone, Pearl and Alexandrite is what comes to mind for June...will check on that some more. Tourmaline crystals grow in columns and are (the gem quality) usually green or black at the bottom fading into clear fading into rosy red at the tops, making a unique banding effect. That is how it got the obvious watermelon name. It is precisely the color of a ripe watermelon!

What about for Oct? I seem to remember being told my birth stone is an opal- which, of course, makes me look like a corpse. :) Anything brighter as an option? By-the-bye, excellent work Marica! This place is great!! :)

ACK!!!! Marcia! really- i can spell when i remember to pay attention to what i'm doing! Sorry dear! *blushing*

Whoa, honey. You have a *real* Alexandrite? Do you know how rare that is? Even the lab-created (same physical and chemical properties) are very expensive. BTW, tanzanite doesn't change colors. Tourmaline comes in many, many colors. I do like the green as well and better than emeralds, which are so cloudy and flawed usually. Many stones (besides topaz) are irradiated for color. In Russia, they make blue diamonds that way or maybe it's just intense heat.

And while we're on the subject, I think I heard that there were new sources of aquamarine on the market from China, which may account for greater quantities appearing in stores. From the ones I've seen, they don't have the same lovely greenish tinge and are more light sky bluish, which defeats the purpose of having an Aqua IMO.

october also has rose zircon (a bright and delightful pink) am not sure if that's a precious stone or a cheap alternative to opal. i don't care for the white opal, but when you find it in the most intense irridescence, it can be quite beautiful (a fiery blue/aqua)... tanzanite only appears to change colors in light, of this i am aware, but did you know that upon tilting it, it seems to be slate gray? thanks for visiting marcia's geo board! way to go, marcia, you're bringing droolers over!! woohoo!!

the aquamarine i own came from china and are more blue than green, but because of the faintness of the color and the fact that the colors you're wearing only enhances the color of the stone, i find it quite enchanting :) do they irradiate aquamarine as well, to intensify the color?

Wolf, hon, the quality of opals you see in this country makes people hate them!! What you will see in Australia would blow your mind! The normal opals are on fire with color leaping out. The black opals (which are really greenish) are gorgeous and I have something called boulder opals that are deep blue and green. Blue zircon is very rare (isn't that an alternative for December). I know they don't really change colors, but appear to be different colors in light. I have tanzanite and don't recall anyone ever saying it would do so. I'm a little rusty, but I know there's another stone beside alexandrite that would do that. It will come to me.

hee hee hee...won't Marcia be surprised to see me here!? And no, I've never heard of anyone irradiating Aquas.

that's what i love about tanzanite. i fiddle with it all the time to see the way the light affects the color!! have never owned a real alexandrite and really didn't know they actually were a stone (haha, and i'm a june baby)!! about the opals, have a gemstone book and when i found the other colors opal can display i was quite impressed! have never seen blue zircon, will have to look that one up. we'll have to find some pictures to post here (i'll post some after i locate that book!!) i would love to see australia period, not to mention all the stuff i'd find there *grin*

you snuck in ahead of me again! *laugh* guess i don't type as fast as i used to...

ok, i just went out on a search and found this website on birthstones. will investigate it and see if it's any good-- http://www.jewelrymall.com/birthstones.html

If you like the grey slateish look of tanzanite (although I prefer it in the more valuable blue-violet shade), you should see silver and violet sapphires!! *oil up them digits* ;-D

actually, i love the tanzanite in that magical bluish purple, it's so vibrant! the website is great. it lists modern, traditional, tibetan, indian, and other birthstones for each month. it further breaks it down into astrological birthstones. each month is broken down with references and places to purchase...really really interesting!!

I turn my back to get another Topic going and what a super surprise I find in Precious stones. Thanks for all of the postings. Opals - black ones are magnificent as are fire opals which are red to red-orange. Oil them to help keep their luster, but be aware that it is little pockets of fluid trapped in the stone which makes the rainbows ( just like in the sky) and they are fragile. Do not hide them in your refrigerator. Do not bang them against hard surfaces. They will shatter. I have a blue Zircon and it is lovely- a medium steely teal blue color. I am wearing my real Alexandrite, and it turns three colors - though the third color only once in the High Sierra on a very clear day. Mine is green by Day and amethyst by night, but neither are very pretty colors. It turned blue in the Sierras! Sapphires come in all colors of the spectrum except red. They are rubies. Ok next posting is on Bi-refringence - which is the apparent colorshift in a stone. and Pleiochromism. Class tomorrow... I am delighted that you all came here to post!

well, i shall now be on the lookout for alexandrite (if i can afford it!)

Wolf, I wear my Alexandrite (Marquise cut set in white gold) on my wedding ring finger in honor of someone born in June. It looks great with any color setting, but it is usually set in white metal - estate and old world settings were silver and current ones use white gold - especially since the prices went up. If you cannot find a real one in something you can afford, I have seen some good ones which do the amethyst-to-green change rather well. They are also not cheap, but are much more affordable. Be are of the ones which go from greyish to pinkish. That is what you find in Mexico and is another stone entirely (but I have one I love!)

Dichroism Some gems are of a crystal structure which causes light from different angles to exhibit different shades of the same color. Rubies have this quality and it distinguishes them from all other deep red stones (Spinels and Garnets). All corundum gems - Sapphires - are dichroaic. (also known as Pleochroism Birefringence The crystalling structure is such that it produces double images. Calcite, Zircon and others exhibit this quality. When looking through a faceted stone from the top, the bottom facets will appear double. The occurrance of two different colors in the same stone viewed under differing light sources, as in Alexandrite is called something I cannot find (yet!)It has also been observed in green or bluish grossular Garnet from East Africa which have been observed to turn red. (Still hunting for the name of this optical quality...check out this URL as a possibility for your specimen http://www.chatham.com/mainalex.htm)

The term for the two-color optical quality of Alexandrite is considered an extreme and very rare form of Dichroism For more information on Alexandrites (including the price of flawless stones from Brazil = $20,000 per carat) http://www.houseofonyx.com/gem1.html More on cut stones http://18carat.co.uk/alexandrite.html

There are lesser grades of Russian Alexandrites which turn from brown to yellow, but I have never seen one.

I wonder what color German Alexanders turn...hmmm...

Anything from red to pale, depending on how Marcia looks at them ;-) This may well become one of my favourite topics...Well, the female brain has a large area attuned to shiny things, remember? :-)

Depends upon what I have written in my last message to him, I guess...Gi, no telling my secrets in here... but you share that proclivity as well, as I recall...;)

Indeed! And have already bookmarked that birthstone site Wolf told us about... am going hunting for it as soon as I can! The DH is feeling generous...;-)

Check out the other ones I put on, too. Generous enough for an Alexandrite?

I doubt that... Alexandrite is now being used as the core for laser machines used in definitive epilation.

ooh...neato...

Why are they using beryl rather than corundum? (William - do not even think about it!!!)

but think of the cool designs that could be traced out on me...

The Illustrated man?! (I do not know what cool designs are there now!)

that's true...hehe...

please no pics, wer *grin* i don't think i've ever seen an alexandrite in our local stores, probably have to go to some high-faluten place and that means i couldn't even afford to walk in the door. the last time the big alpha wolf was generous i came home with a 1 carat anniversary ring *gush* it looks, to the untrained eye, more expensive than it really was, but this gal ain't complainin'!!

I gave you some resources on the net. Check them out first, and there are some better and better man-made ones as well.

Wolf, I am grateful for small packages which sparkle. I am easy to please because I get so little anymore. Congratulations to Alpha Wolf and to you.

oh, thanks! i forgot about the websites you posted, thanks for reminding me!! and you know what else? since i go out of town on business, i treat myself to something special. have purchased several pieces of jewelry this way and because i'm frugal (for the most part) haven't broken the bank *grin*

Good for you - I am frugal too, but on occasion...Glad to hear you say that, Dear!

Quite the busy place!! Is there a gem sale going on? *whipping out her credit cards* Alexandrite is now being used as the core for laser machines used in definitive epilation. Hair removal?

It would seem so. Wish she'd get back and let us know. Are hedge trimmers far behind?!

Hair removal is what i mean. Some of you know that part of my job is also hair transplanting. I haven't done any removal, but have seen it done and it seems pretty cool. Ruby lasers can also be used for hair removal (as for removal of small vascular lesions and pigments), but apparently alexandrite lasers can do better in less time. However, they are stupidly expensive and therefore hair removal by this means is also stupidly expensive.(I think it is probably worth it, though;-))

You are our resident expert. Thanks for the input, my dear. (Please do not ornament or carve my friend...!)

Ooh, I almost forgot, I have a laser-ruby ring set in heavy Mexican Silver. It is made from the leftover pieces of perfect rubies and is a rather good-sized stone for my little fingers, but the color is outstanding!

neato!!

What do you mean re: laser ruby? Industrial grade?

Yes, they cut the middle out which is the most perfect part, and the rest is culled for the gem trade. Mine is flawless as far as I can tell (10x and higher magnification) Laser rubies are not "industrial grade" the way we think of "industrial diamonds" - to be laser material, the ruby must be flawless.

It seems like I can learn a lot here, if I ask the questions. However, you must not think my questions ignorant. the asker is ignorant and asking to learn because it seems interesting. That having been said -- I love diamonds, rubies, and sapphires. and emeralds too. Marcia you mentions industrial diamonds - what exactly is ment by 'industrial diamonds'? The only way I know them is by color, different grades, and flaws. I have rubies from Africa, which are beautiful, but not as bright as say a Burmese. How would I know whether it was a laser ruby? I, however, assume it is gem quality.

There is no soch thing as a stupid question as far as I am concerned. I am delighted that you are interested enough to ask. Industrial gem anything is so full of flaws that about the only thing you can tell about them is that they are diamonds by their hardness. They use them is drill bits and as abrasives. Industrial garnets are used as abrasives, also. In short, purchase only from reliable sources unless you can test what you are buying. Most laser culls are thrown back into the vat and remelted. Mine came from a friend of my Father's who was in the laser business. Your rubies sound lovely. Laser rubies are too perfect - that is the nature of man-made stones. It was a huge problem with the man-made emeralds. Natural emeralds have flaw internally and it was very difficult to achieve just the right flaw patterns as in natural stones. As to how they tell Burmese (the best in the world, btw) from any other rubies is to run tests to ascertain other trace elements in it. Each source has different readings. This is not something you want to do at home unless you have he resources to buy some pretty exotic and expensive equipment. Thanks for stopping by and do come back - love your questions!

hey marcia, i went to one of the sites you listed and looked at the created and real alexandrites and what a price difference. looked at the cheapest real ones but couldn't find a setting i liked. (ditto for the created ones). my mom gave me an alexandrite ring but told me it wasn't real (stone or metal) and the stone came out and i lost it. now i feel bad that i thought it was so chintzy and that experience is what made me thing alexandrites weren't worth much. (silly me, i know *blush*) anyway, the alpha male wolf asked me what i wanted for christmas and i almost blurted "an alexandrite!"

(Marcia) As to how they tell Burmese (the best in the world, btw) from any other rubies is to run tests Natch, but Burma rubies look v. different from African. Burmas are definitely more cherry red, while the African are darker. I know, I have a Burma ruby ring. It's real purty. :)

and about the emeralds. The term used to describe real ones is "occluded." They are cloudy and full of flaws and everyone knows it. That's why the man-made stuff looks so wrong because they are sparklingly clear. I'm sure there are some flawless pieces out there, set in royal headwear or sceptors, or dangling in pendants encrusted with diamonds, but it's so rare to find a clear emerald. Saw some huge emeralds at the Topkapi museum.

Karen, as always we welcome your input. I have a very small ruby from my Grandmother (it was hers as a little girl) and have no idea of its origins, but it is a lovely cherry red. Sounds like it could be Burmese. Perhaps it is time for me to get out the terms like occluded and other optical and physical things in a stone apart from the ordinary cat's eye ans asterism (which are flaws, too.) The treasury of Iran (wherever it is now) has the largest single emeralds known. On a box about the size of a double deck of cards and twice as high, the lid is one huge slab of the most incredible emerald. The sides and back are too. But it is Too Much! It is soooo green it hurts your eyes. If I had a scanner I would pu it on the page...Soon!!!! My Alexandrite is of second quality - which means it goes from Amethyst to forest green. I want a Chatham Created one. They are costly, but they do go from ruby to emerald. BTW, I hope you all buy or receive yours in the day time with a blue sky and sun shining. I got mine at night and it was amethyst no matter what light I used. I had to wait for morning to see it turn green. Then I had to wait for 20 more years to see it turn blue!

Thanks Marcia. Karen, Burmese are much lighter and seem to me not cloudy. I know that the African ruby is darker. Both are beautiful in their own right. I have an African (3k) for everyday and 2 Burmese for special or different occasions. Emeralds are beautiful too. I don't care for the manufactured ones. And Wolf, I hope you get that Alexandrite sooner than Christmas.

Man, it must be nice to have every-day Rubies and Special-occasion Rubies... I asked you whether you were male or female in Horoscope. I am almost positive that you are of the XX gender - but I still might be wrong. Karen and roark are both from Chicago. Small world!

FEMALE; Diann, keep the horoscopes coming. I thought you made them up.

my goodness a 3K ruby for everyday! you go, girl!! ok, you all will think me a fool, BUT, i ordered two pieces with garnet. one is a black hills gold bracelet with links that each carry a piece of garnet and a matching ring. alpha male will never get me that alexandrite now! haha, black hills is so pretty i couldn't resist. it'll be here next week and i'll let you know.

I love Garnets more than rubies for their color. I have 4 garnet rings, one of which I bought on one of my visits to Britain, I also have a lathe pectoral corss set with cab garnets in havy silver. Truly magnificent stones! Let us know how you love them when you get them.

Welcome Diann =) Go happy to meet you. I think I need to hunt for better astrology stuff...some of that is pretty weird.

astrology has been discussed at paraspring, genx, porch, and spirit! i don't believe in it, but some of it is really uncanny....

Did that long Gemini thing I posted sound like you? I am terrible with grocery carts. My son won't let me wield one!

did i miss the long gemini thing? where did you post it? i have to have the cart when i need one. my kids want to run into everything with it and i can't stand the "no control" thing.

Porch 55.170

k!

wolf, you are so right about alpha wolf. You definitely have to take things into your own hands, like I did. I was loving myself. about para: is there anyone over there that soothsays?

Marcia, I almost forgot. are you a geologist?

I ended up with more credits in earth sciences (Geology, Paleo, Mineralogy, etc) than I did in my major so I got a split degree...you could call me a geologist without the math credentials.

Diann, I don't think there is a Soothsayer in Para, but you could check - or ask Wolf about a topic to open if you are one yourself. I would come forsooth! ...and forthwith.

i'd be more than happy to open a soothsayer topic, not a problem!! say the word, and since i'm not extremely clairvoyant, because i'm sure i wouldn't be able to read your mind *grin*

There are more to garnets than the traditional burgundy ones you know. Let's see if I remember...there's tsavorite (named after the Tsavo park area of Kenya), which is green, and a necklace I have has a teensy little orange bit of garnet, which I believe is called Mandarin garnet. Can't do the Black Hills stuff because they use mainly 12K or 10K gold and all the alloys that are put in for the color!! Bad enough some 14K will make black marks on my fingers, although I am a huge fan of rose gold and have many pieces both new and antique. For a minute there, I thought I was OT but it is "precious metals" too.

fortunately for me, i've no probs with the jewelry i wear regardless of chemical composition. karen, can you wear white gold, platinum, or silver? the garnets on the BHG bracelet and ring (!!) are kinda orange-burgundy, real earth toned. it's very pretty. have you all seen the orbis rings? (i think that's what they're called). you can interchange stones. saw some at a craft show that were $60 for the petite sizes and came with 8 stones. didn't get one, but maybe next time when i learn more about them and the kinds of stones used.

Karen, you must have been reading my mind. I was about to post about garnets. I love the rich red ones, even better than *gasp* rubies just because of the color. (I think garnets are bad luck for my family. Son gave one in a ring to a lady and he is not seeing her anymore. And, when I was in California for 4 months I received a goregous ring of Garnets and I will most likely never see the donor again...) Tsavorite is an interesting stone - the rich green color is due to vanadium "contamination." Garn ts come in colors varying from Yellow to violet with all shades of reds and oranges inbetween. Spessartine Garnets are a righ red-orange from Brazil and from such diverse places as New York City (found when they dug up a street) and in San Diego County, California. Uvarovite is deep tourmaline green and quite rare and therefore expensive, as are the violet stones. Grossular garnets have asbestos inclusions which impart a silky luster. I have a green one of these, but it is not transparent, so only of nterest to my mineral collection. Most common red garnets are Almandine with the brown to deep red color. Pyrope is the ruby-colored one, and a flawless specimen can cost almost as much as a ruby of the same size. Rhodalite is the third form of red garnet is the most costly of the red garnets for a rare flawless gem.

Wolf, your orangish brown-burgundy garnets are Hessionite.

That same necklace has a little Pyrope in it as well. What's interesting is that the gems were cut by Swarovski of the crystal fame. Had never realized that they did gem cutting. So they are brilliantly faceted. As soon as I posted, I realized I had forgotten Rhodalite garnets - Raspberry rhodalites - and the Hessionites. It will take a while, but it will all come back. ;-D Wolf, I don't have any platinum and very little white gold, but I do wear silver all the time, with no problems at all. Now, I'm trying to remember which is the alloy that most people have problems with.... argh!!

Copper!

One summer on sabbatical from UHH we visited my parents in Tucson, Arizona. There was a nice little arroyo (dry creek bed) which ran across the back of their property, and I discovered what the local kids were calling "sand rubies" - perfect dodecahedrons of Garnet - just a wee bit bigger than sand grains. I sat out there all summer and got a little vial full of the prettiest perfect little garnets - for my collection. It comes back to me because I have my mineralogy texts right beside me =)

Copper, no that's not the one. Besides, copper is what is used in rose gold. *still thinking*

zinc? Tin?

pewter?

(Everybody join in! It's 20 questions in Geo!!!)

i don't know, thought it was copper as well....

Me too - that is why they epoxy those copper "health" bracelets or else coat them with 24K gold (which is so thin and so soft that it will be gone before you have gotten any "benefits" therefrom.

I think zinc is responsible for many allergies to metal alloys.

I was wondering when we would shake the medical faculty of Spring out of the trees to offer their comments. Thanks, Gi. I suspect zinc, too. Copper can turn you colors (it turns me green,) but nothing like zinc...that makes lesions. Not a good thing!

didn't know that about zinc! so what do they use on those cheapy earrings? you know, the posts that, when you leave the earrings in overnight, you get a crust on the earring hole? (sorry about being so gross!)

They're supposed to be surgical steel if they are not gold...but on really cheap ones, it might be almost anything. Zinc is used to harden things like copper to make brass or bronze and to make gold and silver less fragile and more affordable.

and that happens to me even with nylon posts, Wolf...