Wear lot's of leather and boots. Ride within the limits of your bike and always..always..expect a cager to do the unexpected.

Pay attention.

Entertain a small positive fear.

Very true, Yves. The second I quite being afraid of motorcycling is the second that it ceases to be fun and ceases to be safe. Also, Motorcyclist' cover story this month is "How to ride faster, smarter, safer" (complete with a guy doing a wheelie on a GXS-R--go figure). It's got some good stuff--if only you could remember all these techniques. Next spring I'm going to take another Experienced Riders Course with the Motorcycle Safety Foundation. I find these classes very helpful.

Expect all other road users to be total Idiots, occasionaly you will be pleasantly surprised, Ride within your limits (and those of your bike) Beware wet leaves, drain covers, white lines and (whats the polite way of putting this?) the stuff the animals leave behind, all of which have casued me to fall off in the past

Beware liquids in the road, it's not always water, as I found out once pulling out of my office in Jamaica on the bicycle; I went right into an oil slick and fell. Fortunately the approaching traffic was far enough away for me to be upright and on the side of the road when they came. I always wonder what would have happened if I were on a motorbike.

Only time I high-sided was on oil on an entrance ramp. Very Surprised. The fear factor is one I've had since day one and I think evrything kind of follows nicely afterwards, keeping me safe. I invariably feel guilty along with a rush after a roadrace skirmish. I'd say I run 80-85% 95% of my time. And I see more lunatics on bikes every season.

Yeah, I've had a high side myself--hit a patch of oil in the rain. Totally my fault because the intersection was one that takes about 4 minutes for the light to change so cars just sit there and drip oil. I was in a hurry to get home and out of the rain--well, you can figure out the rest. A little patience don't hurt.

Taught me real good. Had just slowed because I was being eyeballed by a sheriff's car, leaned to exit and BAM saw the bike going under me in the opposite direction; Quaker State can dribbling oil onto the edge of the road. Gravel's even scarier because it's everywhere here. Maybe signs that say "Do ya feel lucky, punk?" might help?

A nice healthy combo of all of the above, ESPECIALLY the first two on Shebees list, gotta watch the morons, cause they ain't watchin for you.... Shane

Hear Hear! And the morons include truck drivers, car drivers, bikers, cyclists, pedestrians, in short: EVERYBODY! The drivers here in Quer�taro are as mad as those in Jamaica!

The cyclists are watching you. They're terrified you'll run 'em off the road either physically or with all that noise!!

Nah, I don't think bicyclists have much to fear from a motorcycle cuz we motorcyclists are really paranoid about hitting anything. A car could hit a bicyclist with only a minor scratch. If you were to hit a bicyclist on a motorcycle, it would be bad news for each of you. I have an uncle who used to ride his bicycle 100 miles per day but he got into three accidents. Made a terrible mess of his back--it's dangerous out there, no matter what you ride.

Always wear boot, long pants, long sleeves, full-face helmet, and gloves. It puts you in a mind-set that you can get hurt out there. There are lots of sensible clothes that can protect you and you don't need any fancy "motorcycle" clothing. Needless to say, do your bike pre-checks and keep that bike in a safe condition.

What about safe cornering? Any recommendations here?

Good question. Mostly the issue of cornering safely is speed (I think most single bike accidents occur in a corner and mostly cuz the person was going to fast), but there is (as in all aspects of motorcycling) the issue of attention. Slow down for the corner, keep your head/eyes pointed through the corner to the exit of the turn, then gradually accelerate. One good thing to learn is how to brake in a corner comfortably and safely. Some people believe you're not supposed to ever put on your brakes while leaned over, but learning to do so calmly and in a smooth manner is a great skill.

What about techniques of landing if the unthinkable happens, and your bike drops in a corner? Can you do things to prepare yourself and land more safely. I once saw a film clip of Evel Knieval landing after a crash and he just rolled and rolled till he popped up unscathed.

Landing techniques, hmm... Terry you are right, try to roll (this also applies to falling down stairs :)) Get away from the bike! Kick it away from you, jump off it, what ever it takes, but dont get stuck under it! Sliding down the road on your own will give you gravel rash at a minimum, sliding down the road with the bike on top of you is worse! You also have very hot bits on the bike, a friend came off with only a little grazing, but a nasty 3rd degree burn on her leg, that needed skin grafts, from the exhaust where she was trapped under it A different friend also suggests, if an impact with another vehicle is unavoidable, at the point where it all goes into slow motion aim for the cleanest, least rusty bit of the car, you dont want tetanus to add to your troubles!

Whew! Landing? If you can think fast enough, protect your hands, close to your body, and try to stay almost in a ball. As Shebee says getting away from the moving mass of metal is priority one. When I got off, I bounced, over the bike, on my back, then went into the balled-up position. Luck helps more'n anything!

You want to low side. If you lose traction in a corner and the bike starts to slide out, leave the brakes locked. If you let off the brakes you'll regain traction and instead of a simple slide out, the bike will flip up and over, likely making you airborne and possibly landing on top of you. That's called a "high side". Trust me, I know.

Well I hi-sided, believe me. Having time to think was out of the question. I feel most go down due to mireading a corner and proper cornering practices of countersteering (Iknow, an old saw). As to going down alone, I don't know; I've seen 3 crashes when riding in small groups, due to the rider not thinking of riding as such but more showing their stuff, and forgetting foolishly about something simple. Trail-braking takes practice at really moderate speed (55) to get the feel for it. Practice includes kno ing the bike you're on, as i find going from a longer wheelbase ride to say, a 750, makes me concentrate on the quickness of handling different lean available.

ouch. Thanks Jim for the helmet plug. As ridiculous as everyone seems to think they are, and those few who rant about "freedom to bash their brains in" helmets are a pretty good idea. Friend of mine was hit by a moving van (running top speed through a red light) and her helmet saved her life. She didn't come out unscathed, though. She was in a coma for 3 weeks and spent a while in rehab. Now, two years later, she is back to her old job -- mechanical engineer and gingerly getting back on the bike again. I strap one on to ride 3 blocks... and remember her story everytime.

I wrote the words "Anti-Tiger Device" on the back of my helmet in Jamaica. Tiger was one of the better dance-hall artists in Jamaica; not much on meaning, but he definitely had style. He generally rode without a helmet, I think he had a CBR600 or a Ninja 600. Anyway, he crashed into a limousine and sustained brain damage. He can function (after long rehab, more than a year), but he can't perform well on stage any more.

I owe my life, such as it is, to Bell Helmets. I see other brands I'm attracted to for one or another reasons, but I'll give my money to Bell, figure I owe it to 'em! Bought Bell bike helmets for the kids too. Only time I get on without one is to move the bike a short distance, even then I feel guilty.

and those few who rant about "freedom to bash their brains in" helmets are a pretty good idea Well, I rant about the freedom to bash your brains in too, but I'll always wear one. I've been around the block sans helmet on a standard style bike--I can see the attraction. And as a civil libertarian I think that it's a personal choice to decide, but you won't see me without one.

They just overturned the bicycle and motorcycle helmet laws in Austin. Except for kids under a certain age.

I always wear a helmet when I ride a motorcycle (unless I'm offered a lift on the pillion and don't have my helmet), but I never wear a helmet on the bicycle. I don't own a bicycle helmet, and I've never seen a bicycle helmet with a proper brim, which I consider to be a very important safety feature, as it keeps the glare out of my eyes. My full-face helmet has the same problem, but I get around that by leaving the visor up to reflect the sun from my eyes, letting my glasses take the brunt of the wind. I've seen an open-face motorcycle helmet with a fixed brim here in Quer�taro for N$300.00 (300 new pesos). If I find that I can afford it, I'll either buy it for prospective pillion passengers or wear it myself and let the passenger wear my current helmet (I bought goggles before I bought my full-face helmet).

Frank (the Bell patriot), Bell has also taken me through 2 pretty nasty bifs. A barbed wire fence and I got into a struggle a few years ago after bombing down a tricky singletrack. Thanks to Bell and Vitamin E there are few reminders of the five strands of wire that slid (uncomfortably) over my head, neck, right shoulder, side and thigh. The other big one was out at the Rifle Range outside of Austin. A perfect endo on "scary downhill" plopped me perfectly on my head -- denng the styrofoam, cracking the sh ll but leaving my head just a little foggy.

Wow! Glad you made it through both mishaps. I've a barb-wire story too but it's not bike related (o;}. Funny thing is how I rode my bicycle for years & years without a helmet and never had problems, now most everyone wears a lid. Twice I've tried motorcycling without a helmet for a few miles and really didn't care for it, the whole "in the wind" deal. I see guys in Connecticut all the time flying sportbikes down the interstate, helmetless, can't figure out how they stand it much less why.

Bell makes bicycle helmets? I didn't know that.

Yeah, Frank, it would be miserable on a sportbike sans helmet because the windshield is designed to force the air in your face. No doubt that these bikes were designed to be ridden with helmets.

You all need to re-think your helmetless short, close to home jaunts on the bike... Just like the automobile, most horrific crashes on motorcycles happen within a 10 mile radius of the owners home, at speeds under 30 MPH.... What is the phenomenon?? Over confidence!! When tooling around close to home you are generally familiar with your surroundings and "know" where you are going..... This automatically causes your brain and senses (or lack of em LOL) to become relaxed and the next thing you know your goi g for a spill, or getting plowed by the guy up the street because "He didn't see you" and you weren't watching for him.... One must NEVER let there attention lapse due to "Comfort with surroundings", It'll kill ya.... Oh, and I enjoy the OPTION of not wearing my helmet pretty regularly, and I have no desire to Bash in My Head, Pick Gravel outta my Arms and Legs, Suffer 3rd Degree burns..... I just like to think that the decisions I make are MINE, And that I am responsible enough to live with the consequences of those decisions.... Shane

I agree Shane. As I said, a helmetless ride for me is usually a parking-spot move, where I don't want to push the bike. I do remember that statistic in the car and on the bike. Going around the "block" here is taking your life in your hands since it's all blind bends and hill, and the drivers are pretty wild despite the "children playing" and "school bus stop" signs. A perfect setup for an accident.

Shane, I respect everyones' decision to "bash their head in" but dammit, if youre the overconfident biker that slides across the lane into my car, I sure as hell don't want your gray (now red) matter all over my windshield and my conscience especially when it was your (hypothetical situation) own damn fault! I'm all for allowing people to kill themselves but just don't take someone else (emotionally or physically) with them! A MTB runnng through sketchy terrain needs a helmet as much, or more, than the ne t guy but if he bites it, it's on no one else's shoulder, windshield or conscience. It's just a shame.

I see it a little differently. First of all you don't have a wreck and say "if he'd had a helmet he would have been fine". There are way too many variables involved and it just can't be determinted. Are you safer with a helmet? Undoubtedly. But you're also safer if you stay home. And statistically you're much more likely to seriously injure another automobile passenger than a biker. Should we force helmets in all cars? Should you just stay home?

Home? Noooo. A plane could lose a motor that fall on your house..Better wear a helmet there too :o) Yves

There ya go Stacey, feedin' the bears....(o;

LOL! Hee. That's funny. You know something? It's actually illegal to wear a helmet in a car. Something about obstructing your sense of sight and hearing....

Speaking o' Bears and Snow, to quote Pooh: "I'm feeling a bit more snowy behind the ears than ever before."

What famous ex-Texas governer rides a Harley Davidson?

Ooops. Sorry, this got posted in the wrong place. If you know the answer, go to the next topic after this one and answer there.

Stacey, take a look at the number of motorcycle fatalities where the motorcyclist is at fault... Oh, and your windshield would wash, and my choices should be no excuse for someones (even mine) lousy driving.... Shane

I wonder if we're going to have to mount and expedition to dig Stacey out of the snow today?

Ann Richards... I'm too lazy to go to the next conference. Feeding the bears, eh? I get into these kind of discussions. And about forcing people to wear helmets in cars (beyond the fact that these people are 'usually' protected by four sides and a roof) we do make them wear seatbelts. Alright guys, enough for me. I better get off the computer before a power surge blasts through my CPU and sends fatal amounts of electricity through my fingertips and cooks me from the inside! :)

American car companies stopped making convertibles in the Seventies because they thought that they would be outlawed for being unsafe (The power of Nader and NHTSA; fortunately curbed now.)

Really stacey, then we'd be talking about you in the cooking conference. Snowgirl!

No one can get a word in edgewise in that conference, so talk away!

O.K., this is off topic, but... Two things. For those keeping up with the saga of my vehicle, I've bought a brand new "Chevy Tracker" (they've canned the GEO badge, which is fine by me--it's still made by Suzuki). Here's a pic (this is the color--it's actually very close to British Racing Green--the ultimate auto color): Notice that XRoads was down for a day or two--we can expect intermittent reliability as I have no control over the administration and upkeep of the server.

What's XRoads?

XRoads = Motorcycle CrossRoads WAS the best conference board for mature motorcyclists of all types, very similar to this board here. Brought together bikers from all over the planet to discuss different aspects of their favoritye sport/pastime. Father: Jon Lind

Frank: "XRoads = Motorcycle CrossRoads WAS the best conference board for mature motorcyclists of all types, very similar to this board here." No offence to Terry, but it still is; although we don't know for how long...

How can this be?

Because the server is in someone else's hands, unfortunately. We yeild control, but not our resolve!

The existence of XRoads relied on me working for an ISP. As long as I had access to a machine that was on the Internet 24/7 and was running NT or 95 we could run the XRoads software. But now that I don't work for an ISP I have no way to host it. That's why I found you. The software is quite excellent. If you'd like to check it out, Terry, goto this address: http://linus.i70.net:8080/ when it asks for a username and password, just invent one.

All this time CrossRoads was for mature motorcyclists and no one told me?

Really like your site Steve. Those Brit bikes are gorgeous. If you know anyone interested in a 1972--all original, extremely fine condition, Triumph Bonneville 650 let me know! For Mature Audiences only! hehe

So that's what you look like! Shame that I don't have access to a scanner! Don't worry, Steve, I don't think they'll throw us off!

OLD is a state of mind! "I have nothing against growing old, its growing "up" I want nothing to do with!" "What do you mean I going through my second child hood? - I havent finished with the first one yet!" I'ts nice to have reached an age where you are no longer childish - just "odd" (I'd be excentric, except you have to be rich to be excentric :) )

Why does Steve's face look familiar? Hmm. BTW, when say "mature" riders, I figure you understand that means squids need not enter, unlike much of what I see elsewhere (MO, CW, a la AOLchats). Yoo're as young as you feel...

SInce "eccentric" means "off-centre", you probably fit the bill!

Do y'all want to see what Stacey looks like? Stacey, is it ok to post that picture I have of you?

What's the deal with you collecting pictures of women Terry? (Very big grin). How much did you say he was asking for that Bonnie, Brad?

I haven't heard from Stacey for days now. Last e-mail I got from her was on Tuesday. I wonder what happened to her?

I have a lot of pictures of women... I just don't have any women! I wonder if Terry has the same (raw) deal?

Jon, the asking price is $3,500. I think my bud is somewhat flexible. He is moving and needs $$$. She's a beauty. A sale would be a real Triumph!

I assume it'd survive a ride from the D.C. area to Colorado.

What was the topic again?

That is a good price for a Bonneville. They usually sell for more than Nortons and I got $4500 for mine a couple of weeks ago. Yeah, the president of the Utah British Bike Club has no British bike but you ought to see what I'm doing to my Ducati!

Putting in rotten gaskets and Lucas electrics? :-} It took me three tries to get the word "electrics" right in the above sentence. What does this tell you about the influence of Lucas?

Steve, thanks for the info. on pricing. Jon, if you are interested the offer stands. The owner is in England (how ironic) right now, but will be back at the end of next week. I'll keep you posted. And Sam, yes, I presume it would survive the ride. However, I would never make a ride like that on a bike I didn't know inside and out. I do have a friend (an HD dealership mechanic) who owns several Triumphs (in addition to HDs) who could give it a thorough mechanical evaluation if someone is really serious. Matching salad bowl helmet is not included. Other restrictions apply.

I might be serious, Brad. I could afford it about 2 months from now. The new Tracker is making things a tad tight right now. I'll check with you then to see if he still has it. As for getting it back, I'd prefer to ride it, but you're right--if it was a low miles, late model Honda (or any of the big four, for that matter) I'd have nothing against flying in and riding back. But that might not be an option with an old Triumph.

Could you post a pic, like you did with your bike?

Oh. I just noticed the "he is moving" part. Damn. Too bad the timing isn't a little different because I could probably be on a plane in 6 weeks to go down and buy the thing. Oh well. You sold the Norton, Steve? Goodness why? It was one of the most fantastic bikes I've ever seen (a picture of). Gorgeous.

I'm putting this in "Safety" cuz it wasn't too safe, but here's the story of storing my bike last weekend. There was a 40 foot stretch of solid ice straight up hill going to my buddy's garage. I had ridden 20 miles on the horrible rear tire to get there. So my brother gets on the bike, gets on the non-icy dirt road and gets a flying start. Wipes out about half way up. Hilarious. After getting that far it took us about 20 minutes to get the ramaining 20 feet. Neither my brother or the bike were damaged very much (he had a sore ankle the next day, but nothing bad).

Jon, yes he is moving, but not out of the area--that's not the issue. The issue is getting $$. He isn't actively selling it yet, but he may put it in the paper soon. I will try to get a pic and scan it for ya. I don't think a couple of months would necessarily be a big deal for him depending on how committed you were. He comes back from England tomorrow, and I'll get some info from him then. You have a name to live up to! :-)

I'm back! I spent the last few days standing out on I-25 heckling motorcyclist w/o helmets and eye protection... windy!

Now Stacey, would you really do that? Respect is a two-way street, lid or no lid. There is honest disagreement about the benefits of helmets, and the statistics are not as one-sided as you might think. Sometimes helmets work well, and sometimes they can be a liability. There are no absolutes, and heckling helmetless riders is nothing more than a fast way to get a sore throat! hehe The best defense against head injuries is rider skill training, not mandated helmet use. It always has been, and it alw ys will be--demogoguery notwithstanding. If you don't agree, you'll be far more effective lobbying your legislators than the folks with the wind in their hair. He who willingly trades freedom for safety has neither.

It doesn't matter cuz the bikers went by so fast that they couldn't hear her anyway.... What about some earnest money in a month or so?

I think that would be fine. We'll talk--I won't let him sell it without giving you right of first refusal, and I'm sure he'd work with you on the $$ plan. Meet my loan officer, Vinny! He likes animals! hehe

Brad must've missed the debate some weeks back. First of all, duly noted with the respect thing see responses way back when. Second of all, there ain't no way in hell I'd stand outside and freeze MY ass off telling some silly fiend to cover his head. I'll take the Darwinian approach and say that those leaving pieces parts of their brain on the highway shouldn't be reproducing anyway. Just keep the blood off my newly washed car! Whoo! I better be careful with my excuses for being absent in the future. I shoulda just told ya'll I was puking my guts out last week! *smile*

Puking would have been acceptable... :o)

(LOL) okay, I'll remember next time. But if you ever see some girl flagging down cyclists on a busy highway... just think about it, okay?

We almost always pay attention to girls flagging us down! hehe Nice pants!

LOL! Hi-larious.

You washed your car? A luxury I can't afford. See, where I live you wash your car and it's covered in mud as bad as when you left by the time you get home. It's frustrating because it's a pretty color paint and I actually *want* to wash it (something that will wear off soon enough). It'll probably be a few months before it gets washed. Ah, the luxury or asphalt.

I wash my car 2x a year on average -- I get noticeably better gas mileage for a few months afterward! The inside even got a vaccuum! Hey Brad, they may not be flagging you, make sure you pay attention to which finger they're waving! *smirk*

Hee. Yeah, as sexy as we motorcyclists think we are, I've never had a girl actually flag me down....

OOooooohh!

One reason why I want a bike, apart from the fact that it can get me to Ocho Rios when my legs won't) is that it has a pillion, to be used just in case... Since this is about staying safe, perhaps I should get some boots...

I'd say get some boots, not just for safety, but because riding will wear out whatever is on your feet. I have some $120 tennis/hiking shoes I could use (would last *maybe* a year as often as I used to ride), or a $100 pair of Wolverines (the soles will last about a year but I can have them resoled three times before I need new ones). It makes good economic sense.

Jon, do you put your feet down when cornering????????Or to stop??????? Yves

Sam, you might see if you can get some of those new "low" boots they have now. i believe Motoport carries good ones for about $75. They aren't high like boots but offer decent protection and durabilty, better than hiking shoes. in your climate and riding conditions I don't know that you'd need a full boot.

Hee. To stop. I use the "right foot on the brake, left foot goes down" technique taught me at the Motorcycle Safety Foundation class so my left sole goes first. When you put 15,000 miles a year on a bike, almost all of it in town, it'll wear out your shoes.

I'd say use a full boot for safety's sake. It's a small trade off to have your foot/ankle completely and securely encased in heavy duty leather to ensure that there's little chance of getting your toes scraped off. Sure, a full set of leathers will cut into your comfort and might not be your style, but the trade for wearing boots (mine are even steel toed) is minor, in my opinion.

We're talking boots..cool. Just bought a pair Cabella's Wellingtons (low heel, rounded toe boot). They're black with 200gm Thinsulate lining and a Gore-Tex booty. They should arrive tomorrow via UPS (or so they promised). I'm tired of lacing up my hunting boots (same lining and booty), though they're very comfortable and heavy. Left foot first, eh Jon? Wonder if you can replace just one shoe..hehe. Stacey, didn't I see you out on I70 a few months back? What? I didn't hear that..eh? er..Speak up..hehe. You had to be joking I presume. This is a good bunch of people. A refreshing change.

This is a good bunch of people. A refreshing change. Hey, thanks alot!

Coulda been joking... but isn't reality sometimes a joke?!?!

Prefer a stiff Hiking Boot........ Not the old brown bombs that weighed a ton but the new ones that they have are almost like a tennis shoe... Lots of ankle support, they are a leather and nylon mix, and they provide great traction, most of all they're comfortable....

Let's get back to the helmets; it was so much fun. Can't understand why people wouldn't want to wear a full-face helmet. Forgetting about safety, the ride is so much quieter and more enjoyable. And what about all those bugs and tree stuff that keeps banging off my helmet? I wouldn't want that stuff bouncing off my noggin. Back to safety, it's like the safety belt issue. It's the law and you gotta do it. If people don't have sense enough to wear a helmet, then they should be required to. It's against the law to jump off tall buildings, a form of guaranteed suicide.

Allright Jim! I'm not fighting the masses on my own anymore!