(Lidya)I know that Crispin went for that part first, and I have to say that I would have liked him better than I do Adrian Lukis, though I think he is cute as Bingley, in a 'golden retriever' kind of way. I cannot think of anyone preferring AL to Darcy. He was the only casting mistake imo. I think AL was odd casting as well, not neccessarily because I find fault with his acting, but because i dont find him attractive at all. Something about his eyes makes my skin crawl- i dont see how Lizzy (or anyone else) ever found him handsome. Another odd casting decision (IMHO) was Lydia. Why did they pick the AbFab girl, who has got to be 10 yrs older than the character she was playing? She looks particularly old when she's near Maria Lucas, who she's supposed to be the same age as. (Karen)I keep pausing the tape, backing up and replaying those over and over. Tough to get past them. LOL! I think my tapes are getting thin in certain spots as well. -good thing i have a back up copy. :) (Eileen)Reminds me of a story Heide started way-back-when in Fanfic--Lizzy meets all of Colin's characters. Check it out, it's a hoot. Heide, what is the name of this story? Is it archived? I remember it vagely, but would love to read it again. :)

I'm guilty of finding AL rather attractive as Wickham. Remember that british actors are not set in the american model!:-)

And of course Darcy is not an aristocrat--he is a commoner as Lady Catherine points out to Elizabeth. This is somewhat more complicated, I'm afraid: the British aristocracy has several grades, and one of them (possibly the lowest in hierarchy) is the group without titles. The lack of a title alone doesn't make Darcy a commoner sensu stricto. If you really REALLY want me to elaborate on the subject (hopefully not ;-)), I'll try to find my relevant sources... or better still, why don't you enquire at RoP, they have excellent resources on the subject.

(Gi) I'm guilty of finding AL rather attractive as Wickham. I guess I'm somewhere in the middle. I found AL's acting convincing enough - he really talked to Lizzy about serious topics (of course he was lying, but she didn't know that). I think that willingness to talk seriously about personal subjects was a rare trait in gentlemen of that day. Heck it's a rare trait today and is still a very appealing one! But I must admit that AL's looks did nothing for me. There is something very odd about the way the white soldier's uniform pants fit him. Particularly in he scenes when he's walking with Lizzy in the garden he appears to have a horrid pot belly. Sorry Gi ;-)!

I think Adrian Lukis is a great actor and very good as Wickham, it�s among the best performances in the whole series. What happened to me was a bit like what happened to Lizzy in P&P, Wickham looked nice enough at first and totally disgusting in the end. AL made this happen with pretty subtle ways, just with his strange eyes, changing face expressions, voice, body movements and posture. Look at him in the first scenes where he pretends to be a nice guy and then the last ones. He really makes Wickham look ridiculously deceitful and uncertain in the scene where Lizzy says mockingly, "we�re brother and sister you know".

What a lovely conversation you have going here, ladies. (Lidya) I cannot think of anyone preferring AL to Darcy. (SB) Something about his eyes makes my skin crawl- i dont see how Lizzy (or anyone else) ever found him handsome. (Cymbeline) I'm wondering if the 19th-century cad isn't a bit difficult to do believably now days... (Gi) I'm guilty of finding AL rather attractive as Wickham. (Elena) What happened to me was a bit like what happened to Lizzy in P&P, Wickham looked nice enough at first and totally disgusting in the end. Perhaps they could have found a better looking Wickham but AL sure can do a sleazy and oily character to perfection. How many of you ladies who hadn't read or had forgotten the book were taken in by him at first? I always found it interesting that there were only three or four good looking men in the whole production. Compared to Mr. Collins and the townfolk we see represented at the dances, I'd probably have run straight to Wickham too. (Jana) There is something very odd about the way the white soldier's uniform pants fit him. Particularly in he scenes when he's walking with Lizzy in the garden he appears to have a horrid pot belly. Jana, you really should stop checking out those tight breeches so closely. I wonder if you've even found some rather awkward protrusions disturbing the smoothness of Mr. Collins' knickers. SB, my little tale was never completed and I didn't want it archived. It was a joke for Evelyn at 34 when we were discussing the propriety of including other CF characters for Fan Fic. Off topic too - (Cymbeline) btw I noticed that Wickham is also on the Dutch Girls hockey team in a virtually nonspeaking role I believe. But he does have some choice lines - "What girl's going to look at us in this get-up, you daft prat?" (I confess I just watched DG myself the other night.)

(Cymbeline)Would you elaborate? Where was he lacking? How would you have preferred him to be? I'm curious b/c I hadn't thought about the casting, only that Wickham's character is so unlikable. I just think he was not believable in the role. Wickham is supposed to be so charming and handsome that when he tells Lizzy about Darcy, she is thinking of how handsome he looks as he talks. He is so amiable that his manners are taken as proof of his good character, and I was not convinced. I had not read the book when I saw the series (to my perennial embarrassment) and I doubted him from the first and could not believe that anyone would fall blindly for him. I wanted Mr. Darcy from the moment I saw him, you see. Why would you have preferred CBC? I would have liked Wickham to be more like Bingley at the beginning, and I can see how CBC would have made him look angelic, which is how Wickham is described once ("angel of light"). I think it only fitting that the blackguard of the story should incite my distrust! I like CBC's acting. I saw him in Masterpiece Theatre's "Wuthering Heights" and he was very believable in his character (he was not Heathcliff). it's almost impossible to put a girl into that situation now--in the US at any rate Well, if you consider that Lydia is only 16 years old when she runs away, and that Wickham must be around 28, Darcy's age, it is something that can warrant reproof. (SB)She looks particularly old when she's near Maria Lucas, who she's supposed to be the same age as. But Lydia is supposed to be 'stout' and well-developed for her age. I thought Julia Sawalha was hilarious. (Gi)Remember that british actors are not set in the american model!:-) I have seen AL in other films, (he was the murderer in a Miss Marple story) and I have no problem with his looks.

(Heide)Compared to Mr. Collins and the townfolk we see represented at the dances, I'd probably have run straight to Wickham too. Yes, they really seem to have done some work to find all the ugliest little actors in Britain to fill the ballrooms with! Only to make the difference between Darcy & Bingley and the rest of mankind more obvious, of course. Another thing about Wickham�s looks, I don�t think that�s a very important point actually. We must remember that Elizabeth�s situation is actually pretty desperate even though she doesn�t want to let it affect her. She needs to find a man to support her and when she meets a guy with a job who seems to be sensible, nice and good-mannered enough she naturally gets very interested. I think AL was a good choice for Wickham because he�s not very handsome. Making the mistake of liking a man like this mak s Lizzy�s situation apparent and also makes her look very human; she needs to find someone, but not at any cost.

(Elena) the ugliest little actors in Britain Is that a subchapter of the Screen Actor's guild? I can't stop laughing. Good thing I'm home alone. (Heide)I confess I just watched DG myself the other night. I love DG--and I think he wore the same pajamas he wore in AC. I just love him as a teenage schoolboy although I have to say I wanted to smack Neal when he was at the DG's house and wouldn't make a pass. To return to the ULAB, I assumed a number of them were dancers--like the old bald guy who is in the next couple during Mr. B.'s Maggot. In my neck of the woods (which is btw the Wessex estate), we have a lot of 18th c. dance groups who perform at festivals, and I imagined they would use them in movies as they used US Civil War re-enactors in the movie Gettysburg. They're chosen for skill, not looks. Does anyone know anything about this?

Yes, Cymbeline, if I remember my Making of..correctly, the dancers were froma professional group. Still, have they no good looking dancers in England? I'm sure they were still picked for their looks (or lack of) rather than their skill. (how does one draw a mischievous impish look?) Oh and back to DG for a moment (sorry girls), your pajama comparison looks right, Cymbeline, but I'm sure you noticed how his top is opened in AC but shut tight to the neck in DG. Is this boy repressed or what? (If anyone ever wants to bring this to 98, I'll join you there.)

.... dance groups who perform at festivals, and I imagined they would use them in movies as they used US Civil War re-enactors in the movie Gettysburg. They're chosen for skill, not looks. Does anyone know anything about this? As a matter of fact I do! I was talking a year or so ago with somebody involved with a dance agency. Apparently P&P was very popular amongst dancers. There are very few oppportunities for dancers of a "certain age" and P&P was a godsend. They had about 2 weeks work for which they were paid, by dancing standards, a handsome amount but because of the success of P&P, they ended up earning well betweem 5 and 10 times the original contract. They are all still waiting for another opportunity like that. So they were not a dance troupe. They were just jobbing dancers, recruited for the film.

(Lydia)I think I will tape my favorite moments on Nov. 28th. That way I don't have to forward ... Very good idea, Lydia! I think that I will do it too, just to save my fingers (they got too busy some times between the remote and the ice cream spoon ;]). I agree with those who do not find AL's Wickham convincing. However I do think that his performance were pretty good based on our JA's creation of P&P. Just he does not look like JA's description of Mr. Wickham, not charming at all IMO. I was disappointed when I first laid my eye on him. He had this shifty-eyed look from very beginning which made me feel uncomfortable. But think again, how could any one compete with ODB's Darcy? Thus I have mercy upon AL's look. (Gi)Remember that british actors are not set in the american model! Sorry, I'm NOT an american but just can't find AL attracted ;-( (Jana)There is something very odd about the way the white soldier's uniform pants fit him This reminder me of ODB's breaches. Don't get me wrong about what I am thinking of though;-). Do you notice the fitting of it was terrible in several scenes? It was creased right in front of it, even in the wedding scene (compare to Bingley's)! The worst one was when he walked on the dark London street searching for Lydia, it looked like he was wearing another pair underneath it.

(Elena)What happened to me was a bit like what happened to Lizzy in P&P, Wickham looked nice enough at first and totally disgusting in the end. (Heide)Compared to Mr. Collins and the townfolk we see represented at the dances, I'd probably have run straight to Wickham too. (Lidya) I doubted him from the first and could not believe that anyone would fall blindly for him. I wanted Mr. Darcy from the moment I saw him, you see. Well, I intensely disliked Mr. Darcy at first. Handsome, yes, but too disdainful to tempt me ;-) Compared to him, Wickham was pleasant, open, friendly, yet it seemed there was more to him than to the other officers of Lydia's circle. He was not as good looking as Darcy, sure, but as Heide says, he looked much better than everybody else, so between Darcy's insufferable conceit and Mr. Collins' snobbery and the townsfolk provincianism, Wickham became indeed very attractive, IMHO. (Heide)Still, have they no good looking dancers in England? I'm sure they were still picked for their looks (or lack of) rather than their skill. Makeup can make people look ugly too! ;-) (Xian)Sorry, I'm NOT an american but just can't find AL attracted ;-( Neither am I, but isn't the American cannon of beauty the one we in the west live by? Where do we go for beauty? To Hollywood ;-)

(Gi) Where do we go for beauty? To Hollywood Right--the home town of Natasha Richardson, Rupert Everett, Kate Winslett, Rufus Sewell, Emma Thompson, Joseph Fiennes, Gwyneth Paltrow, Juliet Binoche, and ODB himself. Time for another American revolution here. Ask yourselves how AL stacks up against them and what role his looks play in the film--in what way should he look different from Darcy, from Mr. Collins, and from Bingley to convey most effectively the part he plays. And btw I thought Denny was pretty cute. Maybe he should have been chosen to play Wickham?? He looked more boyish. Maybe if he'd been Wickham, he'd have been more Valmont-like, the veneer of charm might have covered the slime more effectively and therefore more believably.

Now now...are we talking about Adrian Lukas or are we talking about Wickham? I didn't think Wickham was too bad and I thought AL as himself in the Making of...looked rather cute. JA describes Wickham as "he had all the best part of beauty, a fine countenance, a good figure, and very pleasing address." Perhaps we're just disappointed that AL doesn't fit those rather lofty standards but he does well enough. And btw I thought Denny was pretty cute Not bad but oily too. He just oozes smarminess when he introduces Wickham to the sisters in Meryton..."outswagger us all, eh Wickham?" (Xian) But think again, how could any one compete with ODB's Darcy? Thus I have mercy upon AL's look. So true. We must forgive him the unfavorable comparison since no one else can compare either. '-) (Gi) Makeup can make people look ugly too! ;-) That's true. Even David Bamber doesn't come across too ill in his publicity still. ;-)

but isn't the American cannon of beauty the one we in the west live by? Where do we go for beauty? To Hollywood ;-) Not all of us, surely? To Hollywood Right--the home town of Natasha Richardson, Rupert Everett, Kate Winslett, Rufus Sewell, Emma Thompson, Joseph Fiennes, Gwyneth Paltrow, Juliet Binoche, and ODB himself. LOL! ODB has called Hollywood various things, but home was not one of them... (Sorry, American friends...) JA describes Wickham as "he had all the best part of beauty, a fine countenance, a good figure, and very pleasing address." Perhaps we're just disappointed that AL doesn't fit those rather lofty standards but he does well enough. Two points here. One: the standards of "beauty" or handsomeness have always been changing throughout the ages. AL's looks in P&P coincide well with a lot of Georgian/Regency portraits. Two: different people at different times and places have different expectations of how fictional characters should ideally look like. The hard trick for the filmmakers to pull is to convince as many viewers as possible that what they see is what they wanted/expected to see.

And isn't Jane the beautiful one? I didn't think she looked better than Lizzie? Still, by Regency's standards, she actually was and the actess was very well cast.

(Cymbeline)Right--the home town of Natasha Richardson, Rupert Everett, Kate Winslett, Rufus Sewell, Emma Thompson, Joseph Fiennes, Gwyneth Paltrow, Juliet Binoche, and ODB himself. Aye, but who was it who showed them to us? And don't forget Harrison Ford, Brad Pitt, Mel Gibson, ecc. I never meant they were born there, only that it was Hollywood who recruited them and soldd them to us as Beautiful. Emma Thompson beautiful? Kate Winslett? Gwyneth Paltrow? Ok, Ok, tastes differ, but I agree they too are soldd as beautiful

IMNSHO, Hollywood has never bought or indeed sold ODB - except down the river, perhaps... (sorry, again, American friends, but there it is...;-))

(For the international droolies who are less familiar with the English idioms, I should explain, so that there's no misunderstanding: "sell down the river" means "let down".)

(Cymbeline) Right--the home town of Natasha Richardson, Rupert Everett, Kate Winslett, Rufus Sewell, Emma Thompson, Joseph Fiennes, Gwyneth Paltrow, Juliet Binoche, and ODB himself. The irony in your statement has not gone unnoticed. And I think you're right in including GP - she's not Hollywood either. Now Rupert....;-)

(Heide) Jana, you really should stop checking out those tight breeches so closely. I wonder if you've even found some rather awkward protrusions disturbing the smoothness of Mr. Collins' knickers. Oh dear, my embarrassing secret is unmasked ;-).

Just what I did not want to know...bulges in Mr Collins' breeches? Yak!!!

(Marcia) Just what I did not want to know...bulges in Mr Collins' breeches? Yak!!! We have a comprehensive listing of Darcy's and Bingley's. Why has no one volunteered to do the same for Wickham or Collins, if in fact there are any bulges to detect in the latter? ;-D

Now where's Mary Bennet when you need her? I think this job would be right up her alley.

Ah, but would Charlotte approve? ;-)

(Gi) Ah, but would Charlotte approve? I'm sure Charlotte would be heartily relieved. Suppose Mr.C. had just gone on to Mary after his fiasco with Eliz. A much more suitable match on both sides, but probably no trip to Rosings.

No trip to Rosings for Elizabeth I meant.

(Cymbeline)No trip to Rosings for Elizabeth I meant She could still visit her sister there, I suppose. But probably had to go along with the other two silly girls and Darcy might never proposed because the daily refreshing his memory of her family :-(

(Marcia) bulges in Mr Collins' breeches? Yak!!! Suffice to say that was one place not many of us were looking! How are your yaks, BTW? (Cymbeline) Suppose Mr.C. had just gone on to Mary after his fiasco with Eliz I remember Mary preening for him in a scene but can't place which one it was. It wasn't the one where Mrs. Bennet tells him Jane is off limits and he sizes up the other sisters before settling on Lizzy (Mary's reading a book in that one). Hmmm. Was it when he asks Lizzy for the first two dances at the upcoming Netherfield ball? Does anyone know the one I mean? Mary's got a look on her face as if to say "pick me! Pick me!" and she's disappointed when he doesn't.

still Yak - y.... >

Was it when he asks Lizzy for the first two dances at the upcoming Netherfield ball? Yep, that was the one. Too bad he didn't take the hint. They would have been much happier.

US and Canadian viewers can see the best version of Pride & Prejudice ever made today on A&E starting 2:00 pm Eastern Time. Is there any doubt it's the best? Even without that smoldering presence of CF as Mr. Darcy it would still be my favorite version. Would dear Jane roll over if she saw it today? No way - it's as vibrant and lively as everything she hoped to convey in words. I can't help myself, I'll be watching it today. See ya later.

Is there any doubt it's the best? Even without that smoldering presence of CF as Mr. Darcy it would still be my favorite version. Hear! Hear!

"Go to it" all you P&P2 watchers, six hours of total bliss. Our new classic starts tonite "Wives and Daughters" and I see that one of the male suitors(?) is played by Ian Glenn. Isn't he Jane Bennet's husband. S. Harker's in real life?

(Lizza) Ian Glenn. Isn't he Jane Bennet's husband. S. Harker's in real life? Yes, he is. They have a son named Finn. Someone said that she was pregnant during P&P, but I have not read it anywhere else. It didn't look like she was.

She was. Just as well it wasn't so obvious in the film.

She was. Just as well it wasn't so obvious in the film The empire waist certainly helped!

For Sewellites lurking here (in the absence of a better place to go or more interesting things to do :-)): Has it been mentioned here before that about a year before P&P hit the TV screens in the UK, Rufus Sewell had apparently played Darcy on stage - I believe in Manchester?

(Arami) Has it been mentioned here before that about a year before P&P hit the TV screens in the UK, Rufus Sewell had apparently played Darcy on stage - I believe in Manchester? That's interesting - I hadn't heard it before. I can't really picture RS playing the subtle shades of Mr. Darcy, but then again ever since P&P2 I can't imagine anyone but CF as Darcy!

but then again ever since P&P2 I can't imagine anyone but CF as Darcy! Go over to Rambles. Moon and I had a time defending that premise over the weekend.

(Evelyn) Go over to Rambles. What does that mean please?

(Evelyn) Go over to Rambles. (Cymbeline)What does that mean please? That's a board that belongs to pemberley.com. It's a virtual community for all projects pertaining to Jane Austen. Rambles is like #72...a catch-all for what doesn't belong anywhere else.Virtual Views is a board that comments on current films.We all started out on the P&P board.Go over some time...it's a neat place. http://www.pemberley.com/bin/ramble/ramble.cgi

...or on other Spring conferences it is a place to talk about the conference but not about things worthy of a topic or necessarily topic-worthy. Blow-off-steam places, actually...as: http://www.spring.net/yapp-bin/restricted/read/porch/7

Did anyone else watch the US Learning Channel's "Great Books" program on P&P yesterday? I bring it up only to complain. ;-) (What else is new.) if they really wanted the words of Jane Austen to come alive, why couldn't they have shown clips from better actors to prove her wit? Elizabeth Garvie as Elizabeth can not wipe that grin off her face even when she's crying and I always knew David Rintoul had a stick up his rear but I hadn't realized 'til last night how that stick goes all the way up to his chin. Those lips barely move. If they really wanted to do JA justice, they should have used both of P&P2's proposal scenes. P&P1 was simply reciting lines. Yes, of course I realize that the program could not use P&P2 for licensing reasons. Sigh.. Was good to see Helen Fielding though. Too bad when she said what influenced her most to base Bridget Jones on P&P was the line "It is a truth universally..." rather than CF.

And they showed clips from the Garson-Olivier P&P! Definitely has to be a case of not getting permission from A&E, as all those other Austen productions (Clueless, S&S, etc.) were shown. BBC wouldn't have been the holdout, as P&P1 was their production and, if you watched the next show (Madame Bovary), the old BBC version was shown as well. I liked Helen Fielding's comments too (although we've heard so many of them before). Probably didn't want to appear too shallow by mentioning CF. ;-)

Actually I always thought the Fay Weldon script for the 1979 BBC version of "Pride and Prejudice" was superior to that for the 1995 adaptation by Andrew Davies. Whenever you read a book you get your own novel more or less in your head, and Weldon's version is much closer to how I see the book.

Weldon's version is much closer to how I see the book. In many scenes, yes. Which is why I had no quibble with them showing Wedlon's version in the Pemberley encounter which is closer to the book than Davies'. But Cheryl, the recitation of Jane's animated dialog just sounds deadly dull coming from those two leads, especially Rintoul. IMO, does not do Austen justice at all. Faye Weldon was a hoot though. I've always liked her and love that plummy voice. Besides Nora Ephron, who was the other American opining?

Besides Nora Ephron, who was the other American opining? Some college professor.An Austen authority?The whole program was d...u...l...l, IMO. Helen Fielding was refreshing .Worse than Rintoul, was the TLC Darcy ...with the little short legs and fat thighs..leaning against the columns of Pemberley(?). Looked more like Connecticut to me.

And there was the other white-haired lady, who was identified (I think) as a "collector." She had the license plates "Janeite" and all the books and made reference to the fact that Austen is all over the web. (Evleyn) with the little short legs and fat thighs..leaning against the columns of Pemberley(?). hee hee. I noticed the columns too. Kept thinking they needed to shot elsewhere or at least pose him differently.

. .I preferred Weldon's script for the dialog, I think, and missed some of it in P&P2, but she had no sense of visuals and motion like Davies had. Her script appealed to the ear, his to the eye. Her script played more like a modified stage play. And I think her additions and alterations to the plot were more jarring and than his -- they seemed much less utilitarian to the flow of the story. ...And I don't care what you say about Greer Garson, she could deliver some of those lines with the proper slyness and humor, as she deflated the pomposities around her with eclat. (It wasn't P&P, I know, but once you stopped expecting it to be, it was very enjoyable on its own terms. So there!!). :-D

(KJ) it was very enjoyable on its own terms. So there!!). :-D It was. I used to like it. Just as I *used* to think that Olivier was a great Darcy. Have since changed my mind. (bet that surprised you, especially that last revelation!)

(Evelyn) Worse than Rintoul, was the TLC Darcy ...with the little short legs and fat thighs. Snort...and all those staring out the window scenes. Humph, think I know what they were influenced by. I didn't find the program dull but maybe that's because I was all in anticipation waiting and hoping for a glimpse of our DB. Heck, I would have been satisfied just seeing a copy of the book with JE and CF on the cover. Surely the Janeite had that in her collection. (KJ) ...And I don't care what you say about Greer Garson, she could deliver some of those lines with the proper slyness and humor, as she deflated the pomposities around her with eclat. Yes, yes and yes. Neither Garvie nor Garson were terrible Lizzys. But both of them could not stop smiling throughout as if that is the only way Lizzy could show her "slyness". JE smiled, yes, but used so much more expression. I grant that Garvie was hamstrung by the static presentation but it is the one-note acting I objected to. Sorry, I know I'm preaching to the choir but I do love spouting off on this subject. ;-)

I agree with everyone's view. I only wish that Davis had included that dinner scene at the Bennets with the coffee and the cards. (As in the book)

That and the prompt about-face by Mrs. Bennett in her opinion of Darcy at the end.

(Heide)..the recitation of Jane's animated dialog just sounds deadly dull coming from those two leads, especially Rintoul. IMO, does not do Austen justice at all. Although Jane Austen didn't write for actors to perform her work, her dialogue is very much actor-proof. No matter who does it, the words are glorious. Good acting is, however, a plus. (KJArt) I preferred Weldon's script for the dialog, I think...but she had no sense of visuals and motion like Davies had...Her script played more like a modified stage play. That really wasn't Weldon's fault. It had more to do with the BBC style at the time; they used videotape. In the 1979 "Pride and Prejudice" the only scenes in which film was used were some of the outdoor scenes. 1970's era videotape was notorious for making everything look worse than in real life. So no one even bothered with cinematic effects for lighting. Cinematography was pretty much unknown, things were just lit, badly. Everything the BBC did from that time looked overexposed. However, I do prefer the overall production design of the 1979 P&P to the 1995 P&P, the costumes and sets were more appropriate in the earlier version. Just about everything in the 1995 was just a little too grand; i.e., Eliza and Jane Bennett should not have worn dresses comparable to those of Miss Bingley.

(CherylB)Just about everything in the 1995 was just a little too grand; i.e., Eliza and Jane Bennett should not have worn dresses comparable to those of Miss Bingley. Were they? I thought the Bennetts' dresses were mostly cotton prints or muslins, while the Bingleys' were heavy silk.

Not all the Bingley dresses were silk, the ball gowns were. Still cotton was considered fashionable for daywear; very fashionable young women would dampen their cotton dresses so that they would cling. Some of these belles in fact caught their "death of cold" from this practice. A few unlucky beauties developed pneumonia. The cotton dresses of the Bennett sisters were much like those a young lady of Miss Bingley's worn for morning or afternoon wear. The dresses for the Bennetts should have been more like the costumes for the Dashwood sisters in the film adaptation of "Sense and Sensability".

And to think this all started with me complaining about the acting. ;-) Anyway, I have nothing to quibble about regarding Mr. Darcy's wardrobe. I just love those breeches and when worn with the boots....oops, passed out again.

I saw the documentary The Making of Pride and Prejudice and they explained how they had tried to show the differences in wardrobe, in the houses and even in the carriages and horses. I thought it interesting and wish they could have gone into more detail. But then again, I suppose this may have been discussed at length in RoP.

Gi, I believe you are correct about the use of different fabrics and I think one of the background tapes (From Page to Screen) touched upon it. The Bingleys wore richer fabrics and more brightly colored fabrics as the use of dye was always more costly, while the Bennets wore cheaper cotton muslins, usually lightly patterned. From the Making of book (pp. 33-4): "We made an exception with the Bingley sisters, we felt we could point out differences in wealth and class by contrasting their wardrobes with the pretty simplicity of the Bennet girls'. The Bingley sisters wear the equivalent of Gucci. "I used a lot of silks from India, quite a lot of lace and much brighter and stronger colors - pinks and lime-green, for example. Evening head-dresses were more elaborate and reflected the medieval influence fashionable during this period. Apart from wanting to look like Grecian columns, women aimed to look exotic, so they used rich colours and lots of wonderful feathers. We really wanted something that would stop the conversation in the village assembly rooms when they walked in."

Being far from an expert on Austen's life and times, and without seeing/reading any 'Making of' material, I can say the differences in dress between the Bennet and Bingley sisters was quite apparent to me in P&P2. We really wanted something that would stop the conversation in the village assembly rooms when they walked in." That headgear really did the job!

(Eileen) That headgear really did the job! ECC alert Don't you think it was overkill? Caroline's face alone has stopped Mack trucks. ;-)

(KarenR)ECC alert Don't you think it was overkill? Caroline's face alone has stopped Mack trucks. ;-) I confess I have a hard time convincing myself that they are the height of genteel fashion ;-)The Empress Josephine herself wore much (apparently) simpler clothes...

When I visited Chawton in '98, they had some original dresses from the JA era and they were exactly like the simple cotton/muslin dresses that the Bennett sisters wore in P&P2.

(Gi)I confess I have a hard time convincing myself that they are the height of genteel fashion;-)The Empress Josephine herself wore much (apparently) simpler clothes... No. They weren't. And yes. She did. The Bingley costumes were intended as a visual joke, to indicate that although there was money, and perhaps even breeding, it could not bestow taste and refinement. It just seemed to me that it was unecessary, Austen's wit and the acting were enough to suffice. The Bennett sisters clothes were comparable to Miss Bingley's in point of their workmanship and detail. Cotton was worn by ladies of fashion, the type of material one dressed in was determined by the time of day. A lady of Miss Bingley's class would have worn a dress similar to one of Jane Bennett's for morning or afternoon wear. The costume design for the film version of "Sense and Sensibility" and the 1995 BBC "Persuasion" were better than those for the 1995 "P&P". The Bennett's costumes should have been more like those for Anne Elliot or the Dashwood sisters. But it doesn't matter if you dress actors in aluminum foil if they can act.

But it doesn't matter if you dress actors in aluminum foil if they can act. Ah, back to the "material" point.

Hello, chickies! Yes, I'm still alive (but barely awake) and have been thinking of all of you for some time now. Thought I'd do a little pop-in to see how if the drool still flows in rich, glistening waves ;-)~~~ Then Yapp choked my computer with all the new messages since I'd last been here and I thought, "Aaah, it's good to be home!" ;-p So...what's new? How are things? Everybody happy? ;-) Believe it or not, I'll graduate on May 11th. Amazing, yes? Those two years, which seemed like an eternity at the beginning, flew passed my head--WHOOOSH!--like the Concord. I'm feeling rather ambivalent about the whole thing. It will be nice to earn money again I suppose, but I don't feel ready yet. I could use another year, if you can believe that (though I don't think my wonderfully patient friends could take it ;-p)...Renate and Arami and Evelyn have each periodically checked in with me, passed on news and have been good enough to ignore my absorption with school. Excellent creatures! I will not forget it ;-) But I digress� The reason I chose to visit this board is that I'm in high Darcy-drool mode. Indeed, I am in earnest! Feels good since I've had no time in all these months to appreciate the very great pleasure a pair of fine breeches on the loins of a pretty man can bestow ;-p A couple of weeks ago, stressed about my thesis, frazzled over my CGI final, and terribly sleep-deprived, I decided to take a night off. My roommate (who is a better sport than I realized) said, "Let's watch Pride & Prejudice" since he'd never seen it and wanted to understand why he is forced to look at pictures of Colin all over the house. I warned him about it being a sort of dignified "chick flick", but he was game and I certainly wasn't about to turn down the opportunity. We watched the first tape and ladies, let me tell you, it was a bee-yew-tee-ful thing! It just never gets old for me. It doesn't matter that I can recite the whole thing and know every nuance of the performances. Each time I watch it I fall hopelessly in lust all over again (bless Colin's little cotton socks) ;-p Though my roommate liked it, I couldn't talk him into doing a marathon. So, when we have an extra hour in between classes and homework, we sit down for another episode. I've never had the willpower to watch it this way, and you know what? It's kinda nice...gives me something to look forward to. Unfortunately we only have one tape left *sigh* What will I do then? If I do the usual obsessive watch-it-five-times-in-a-row thing, he'll goof on me for the next two months. As it is, he's been picking on me for being incapable of watching an episode without making some kind of comment about the breeches or the voice or the...INCROYABLE ;-p Of course, for me watching P&P is a completely different experience than it is for him. I can't look at the dangling watch and fob without thinking of Arami's hysterical...erm...short story. I can't see the dripping, clingy wet shirt without remembering Megan's hilarious attempts to keep people from stealing it. And of course, every horse I see has a name! It's too funny. Half the time I'm laughing and it has nothing to do with the film. I�ve missed it and I realize that I need a little diversion into the depths of depravity to regain my sense of humor. And so, here I am, looking for the comradeship of kindred spirits. My roomie, though a decent fellow I suppose, isn�t exactly enthusiastic about my devotion to Darcy. Men just don't get it :-/ See you soon, chickies ;-)

Nan!!! How splendid to see you. Does he play hockey? Oh well, he did watch P&P2 with you - *sigh* Mine hasn't in 18 years worth of fighting over it. I'm with you. I think I am over it until I get just the merest whiff of the man and I am as good as gone all over again. INCROYABLE is only one part of the man and it without him would just be another...um....yeah! Need the works! Hugs and wonderful things to you. Soo good to see you here again. You were the first to greet me when I first peered in to Drool all wet behind the ears. I try to be as kind to newbies as you were to me - always!

I have made myself a video of just the Colin parts of P&P2 so I don't have to "waste" time fast forwarding when all I want to look at is Mr Darcy.

dsdddsdsvdv

eeeeeeeeee

Hello, Nan, and congratulations! We have missed you and are ready to welcome you back with open arms. . My roomie, though a decent fellow I suppose, isn�t exactly enthusiastic about my devotion to Darcy. Men just don't get it :-/ Just like at my house. Believe me it gets worse.

Nan, oh Nan!! Welcome back and great to hear you're graduating. Always good to hear someone so eloquently admiring Colin's finer points.

What a fine surprise! I was wondering what had suddenly revived this board and look who I found here! :-) Always glad to see you around here, Nan, and have a great graduation! I think I can safely promise we'll be thinking of you on May 11th. We haven't drooled much lately, have we? Been very serious. Count on you to change that ;-)

Nan, we've never met on the boards here. I know you from your older posts, but I joined while you were in the midst of your education. Your reputation does proceed you, and I mean that in a good way. So -- hello Nan.

Aaaah, here you are, Nan, oh, Nan! Practising before jumping back in - what a splendid drooler she is! I'm in high Darcy-drool mode. We need you back here to revive these boards! What an absolutely wonderful splurge of fresh drool... My roommate Careful! People may think you have (or use?) only one room... ;-P Btw, in the UK, where an apartment is called a flat, he would be called a flatmate... ??? I can't look at the dangling watch and fob without thinking of Arami's hysterical...erm...short story. Should I be thinking about reworking it into a... erm... long story, perhaps? ;-) looking for the comradeship of kindred spirits We are here, ready and waiting!

What a lovely welcome! You know, I even forgot the joy of logging in and seeing a topic active. I have been away too long� (Marcia) Does he play hockey? The roommate? No, no hockey. However, he does have that rather annoying I-used-to-be-a-jock way about him. The more exposed I am to testosterone, the more I like fictitious men�hence Darcy ;-p You were the first to greet me when I first peered in to Drool all wet behind the ears. I try to be as kind to newbies as you were to me - always! Aww, that�s sweet, honey! Glad to see the years haven�t dampened your enthusiasm. (Cathey) I have made myself a video of just the Colin parts of P&P2 so I don't have to "waste" time fast forwarding when all I want to look at is Mr Darcy. A girl with a Colin power tape--now that�s what I like to hear! I think I need one of those�preferrably all daggy shots of breeches and big chocolate eyes ;-) (Gi) What a fine surprise! I was wondering what had suddenly revived this board and look who I found here! :-) Well, you can always count on me to surface when I feel a Colin attack coming on ;-p Good to see you, m�dear�been too long� We haven't drooled much lately, have we? Been very serious. Count on you to change that ;-) Serious? This group? Nyah�I refuse to believe it. It�s not only impossible, it�s sacrilege and against all the fundamental beliefs upon which this great, wet place was founded ;-p (Cheryl) Your reputation does proceed you, and I mean that in a good way. So -- hello Nan. Hello, to you too Cheryl ;-) Good to know I didn�t leave any really offensive posts behind me (I think I removed all of those ;-p) (Arami) Practising before jumping back in� LOL, you know me too well. I was just sort of dipping my toes in the water before really going to town ;-p We need you back here to revive these boards! What an absolutely wonderful splurge of fresh drool... Well, here I am ready to let loose my fantasies and make an ass of myself. Who wants to play? ;-p Careful! People may think you have (or use?) only one room... ;-P Goodness, no! We don�t want to give anyone that impression. Btw, in the UK, where an apartment is called a flat, he would be called a flatmate... ??? You know, I�ve been trying to come up with a better word for it myself. I suppose �flatmate� is the most appropriate word, but few people in my sphere would understand what it meant. Also, you need to have a cool British accent to get away with saying a word like that. If you say �flatmate� with a New York accent, it just sounds like affectation ;-p (Arami) Should I be thinking about reworking it into a... erm... long story, perhaps? ;-) I would by no means suspend any pleasure of yours�or mine for that matter. Lay it on me, babe! ;-p Thanks everyone for the graduation wishes. I still have a killer week of final projects coming up and, of course, the dreaded thesis�but I�ll keep checking in as time allows. XOXO

(Nan) Good to know I didn�t leave any really offensive posts behind me (I think I removed all of those ;-p) We've created a special topic for those... Marcia keeps them on her hard drive next to Esbee's stories on:

*lol* It is so good to remember what it was about Drool which made it so special. Gads, yes! Escape from Testosterone poisoning and related ills. But, some of them are still very dear and I have them in my pocket where they are safe and sound. As soon as I wipe the tears from my eyes I shall polish up the glasses, get out my poweer tape of Darcy, blast the tape I made to go with it and hang the cost! Yippee! Nan and Drool are back!

Woo, before you think I have the very dear men in my pocket (have not drooled actively in some time, and it shows)...it is the files....Yes!

Ah, I see some first-rate drool in the horizon. Can always count on Nan to prime the pump. Only one tape left? Ooh, I still get chills when I hear Mrs. Bennet's He has come. He has come at last. So what if she meant Bingley. We know who has really come. And now Nan has really come at last. Mahvelous to see you here again, my dear. :-)

(Marcia)You were the first to greet me when I first peered in to Drool all wet behind the ears. I try to be as kind to newbies as you were to me - always! Me too...ole buddie.You held my hand for...almost six months! Welcome Back! Let's hear some Serious Drooling now!Wait til you see SLOW!He's gorgeous...

(Evelyn)Wait til you see SLOW!He's gorgeous... Isn't he though? I fell for him all over again... ;-)

(Karen)We've created a special topic for those... Marcia keeps them on her hard drive next to Esbee's stories on: Karen, you have to tell me what's the deal with the foot fetish? ;-P (Heide) Only one tape left? Ooh, I still get chills when I hear Mrs. Bennet's He has come. He has come at last. So what if she meant Bingley. We know who has really come. LOL, I know. Poor Bingley is just filler for me. How are you, honey? Long time no see... BTW, we haven't watched the last tape yet (no time with finals and all). But, one day when he was out of the house, I did watch numbers 4 and 5 again (yeah, yeah...I know, I'm hopeless). Oh that walk through the grounds at Pemberley, it is too much for me in my present lascivious condition.. To be able to enjoy the aching lovliness of our freshly dressed DB bolting out the door and running down the steps in search of Elizabeth. Then, the walk up the steps, with the marvelous boots and super hero thighs�SA-LUURP!. Just knock me down and pinch me in the mornin�! ;-p (Evelyn) Let's hear some Serious Drooling now!Wait til you see SLOW!He's gorgeous... Hey you! There you are! I thought, for a moment, that you'd taken a drool break. I'm glad you're still here. When school is over, I'll call...I swear on my Aunt Tillie's eyeballs ;-) And, no I haven't seen SLOW yet. I haven't seen anything more recent than SIL. It sad to be so out of the loop. But think of how much I have to look forward to ;-)

Oh good grief....the stroll around Pemberley....the *wiping my chin* "Miss Bennet??!!" at Bingley's ...so many and only one lifetime to do it in....*SIGH*

It's like the good old times here at Spring... I feel at home again.

Hello I'm new here. I'm an Art and English major ( graduating in June). I came to the States 4 years ago - I'm actually Malaysian. I've just finished watching P&P 2 for the 4th time. It doesn't help that I can borrow the tapes over and over again from the college library for free. I can't convince any of my friends to watch P&P with me. And I'm heartily ashamed of the way I'm behaving. What is happening to me? Why have my senses left me? I am too old to have these sorts of crushes aren't I? Squealing and clapping my hands to myself alone in my room everytime I come across a favourite part ( any sequence with Mr Darcy in it heh heh). Getting misty eyed and smiling to myself at crowded dining halls. What would my bf of 6 years think of me if he knew? Gosh this is so embarressing. Yet the feelings are not alltogether unpleasant and I hate to think that a year from now....this would have been just a phase in my life and that I won't be as coo-coo or hilariously happy as I am now. Anyway here are a few things I have to get off my chest: I just love it when Darcy wears completely black pants . I don't believe that anyone has mentioned this. He has them on when he is giving EB the "look". And I love the part at the Netherfield ball when he's dancing with EB -- precisely at the moment where he says "this is no striking resemblance of your character I am sure" *siiigh* He looks so sardonic and the movement of his head.. the slight rolling of the eyeballs. It always cracks me up and I start having this really crazy loopy grin on my face ( I scared myself looking into the mirror!) Ok... i'm off to lurk at the Republic of Pemberley website now. Bye for now, carol

Sounds quite normal to me Carol ;-) I have been at Drool quite a while now but don't usually find time to say much; trust me though, you will be made feel very welcome. Enjoy!!!

Welcome to Drool Caroline! We hope you stay with us. As Cathey says, we all know what you were talking about ;-)

Welcome Carol! Only four times??? Believe me after a while the 6 year old will know who Mr. Darcy is. ;-)

You know, this topic is Darcy drool, so does that mean we can also drool over Mark Darcy here as well, when the movie finally opens???? Just a thought;)

Congratulations and good luck, Nan.

WELCOME CAROLINE How about that cute half-smile when he says to EB..."On foot"? That's a sure "melter' for me... Stick around Caroline...we love to talk about ODB (Our Dear Boy) in any of his films.

(LauraMM)You know, this topic is Darcy drool, so does that mean we can also drool over Mark Darcy here as well, when the movie finally opens???? Just a thought;) Happy thought indeed... :-)

Welcome Caroline! You sound like you'll definitely fit in here...perfectly normal behaviour... I hate to think.....this would have been just a phase in my life and that I won't be as coo-coo or hilariously happy as I am now Don't you believe it hon' you'll still be a-grinning and a-drolling like the rest of us for years to come!

That should read drooling, of course! Sorry too much moisture on the keyboard ;-D~~~

I rather like the way her peruses her up and down then lets her pass and takes in the sight of her backside straight in front of him... (Tell me about moisture... =)...

So tell us, Carol: ...how old is too old? ;-D